User talk:FloraC

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Thanks for correcting all my mistakes on the supermajor chord's ratio! TallKite (talk) 06:54, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

Question about VisualEdit

Hello FloraC,
as I see, you made part of your edits using the visual editor. Do you remember if it was enabled by default or did you need to enable it yourself in Preferences? (I didn't see this option when I was active before pausing more than a year. I tried it now, but disabled it again: it breaks one of my favorite access keys (v) for the [Show changes] button.)
BTW: thanks for all your gardening work! 🙂
--Xenwolf (talk) 11:31, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

It's enabled by default. I play with another wiki project where there's no such a feature, and I was impressed when I found it here! FloraC (talk) 15:53, 8 June 2020 (UTC)
I see. Is there a way to access advances formatting features like the new table column classes? I tried to find it, but wasn't successful. --Xenwolf (talk) 18:25, 8 June 2020 (UTC)
The feature about alignment is probably completely missing. FloraC (talk) 18:41, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

Difference between clan and family

Hi FloraC,
Do you maybe know the difference between clan and family? Today I found both in Sensamagic. --Xenwolf (talk) 08:59, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

As far as I understand, family: a single comma is tempered out; clan: more commas. Maybe I'm not the best one to ask. I'm just a beginner anyway. FloraC (talk) 11:54, 9 June 2020 (UTC)
Thanks so far, I let you know if I know more... --Xenwolf (talk) 13:14, 9 June 2020 (UTC)

Text alignment "left-9" fixed

Hi FloraC,
The issue you found is fixed now. Apart from the amount of extra work it has certainly created for you, I think it (Approximate Ratios in column 3) looks even better in this form than before.
--Xenwolf (talk) 07:03, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

FJS name

Hi FloraC,
Do you have a good reference for this naming scheme? I'd plead to add a link to it in the template.
--Xenwolf (talk) 19:50, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

Ah, only now I see you already did exactly that. --Xenwolf (talk) 19:53, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

You answered my long-year badness question

... by adding this important clarification. Thanks a lot. --Xenwolf (talk) 11:48, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

Yes that confused me too until I really tried to reproduce them. FloraC (talk) 12:14, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

Quartismic Temperaments

Hey, Flora, remember the computer-generated lists of quartismic EDOs you showed me and Inthar on Inthar's user page? Well, come to find out that the computer missed 44edo on both counts, yet, when I checked it by performing the procedure documented on the monzo page to test for the quartisma, I got "0" as a result, making 44edo a quartismic temperament. I should point out that judging by the degree of relative error for the 7th harmonic in 44edo, I doubt that 88edo will make the cut. So, I'm thinking we should combine our strategies for finding quartismic temperaments and double-check our findings with the monzo test. --Aura (talk) 18:32, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

The algorithm doesn't miss anything. It's a sequence of edos with progressively lower TE error. 44edo is contorted in the 11-limit, meaning that it's the same as 22, which is outperformed by 24, so it doesn't show up. FloraC (talk) 04:39, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
If the algorithm doesn't miss anything, then I'd like to know why the different runs don't all get the same EDOs... --Aura (talk) 01:09, 11 September 2020 (UTC)
The first result is on no-5 11-limit (2.3.7.11) basis. The second full 11-limit (2.3.5.7.11). FloraC (talk) 02:01, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

I should also point out that when I tried this same test on 46edo, I got "-1" as a result despite 46edo seeming to have the telltale signs of being a quartismic temperament- Talk about inconsistency. For the record, Inthar and I both thought that 46edo was one of these quartismic temperaments- but we were all wrong. --Aura (talk) 21:20, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

No it's zero. You can also verify that by simply looking at the interval table. FloraC (talk) 04:39, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
I must point out that after double-checking and correcting an error in my calculations, I've reestablished that 46edo actually does temper out the quartisma. However, judging from from this calculation, there are still EDOs like 23edo that at first glance appear to temper out the quartisma but nevertheless actually fail the monzo test. --Aura (talk) 05:17, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Okay, I need help to redefine the quartismic temperament properly. After stumbling across this site, I'm now trying to re-gather my bearings. All I know is that the Altierran temperaments are a specific type of quartismic temperament that tempers out the schisma as well as the quartisma... --Aura (talk) 02:18, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

Did you get my wiki email?

... maybe you dropped it as spam? Best regards --Xenwolf (talk) 11:15, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

Yes and I replied using the same wiki mail function. Seems you don't receive it. I'll try again. FloraC (talk) 11:35, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
Should work this time. FloraC (talk) 11:37, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
Yes, received it now (for the first time). --Xenwolf (talk) 12:51, 10 September 2020 (UTC)

159edo Interval Chart

Hey, Flora, I saw the conversation on the discussion page for Table of 159edo intervals. I hope you like what you see now. I also hope that this chart isn't made shorter after I finish my work- I really want others to see both members of any given pair octave compliments- especially when the more obscure intervals are involved... --Aura (talk) 03:29, 17 September 2020 (UTC)

That looks very neat. And it need not be shortened to half-octave since it's not in the main edo page, where I reckon spacing is a matter. FloraC (talk) 03:45, 17 September 2020 (UTC)

undecimal subminor second, undecimal supermajor seventh

May I invite you to discuss the topic(s) under Talk:33/32#undecimal subminor second? --13:09, 18 September 2020 (UTC)

FJS help

Hi FloraC,
you seem to have a solid understanding of the Functional Just System.
Would you please help me to get started with filling in the FJS name parameter] on interval pages?
--Xenwolf (talk) 20:27, 18 September 2020 (UTC)

Sure. And to answer the question when an interval starts with P, M, m, A, or d, an interval in FJS is interpreted as Pythagorean tuning offset by some commas. So if the Pythagorean note is major, it is M, if the Pythagorean note is minor, it is m, and so on. In that regard it's the same as Helmholtz-Ellis so you might first get started from that. FloraC (talk) 05:50, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Diatonic and Paradiatonic Functionality Chart

Hey Flora, I recently made a new version of the Musical Function Chart that I referenced in out discussion on 33/32. Would you mind looking over this? I hope this version is better than the one I initially referenced in the discussion.

New Diatonic Function Map.png

As you can see, 33/32 and its octave compliment 64/33 both appear in regions designated "Superdietic" and "Subdietic". Both "Superdietic" and "Subdietic" are related to "diesis" on account of a diesis- according to one definition- being the smallest usable melodic interval. I know I've found that 33/32 is definitely large enough to be a melodic interval in its own right. However, I also can't help but notice the fact that intervals in both the Superdietic region and the Subdietic region tend to have multiple functions- that is, depending on both the direction of a tonality's construction and the structure of a given chord, they tend to alternate either between primes and seconds or between sevenths and octaves. For instance, while 33/32 functions as a prime in a 22:26:33 triad built on the octave reduced 11th harmonic, it functions as a second in a 28:33:42 triad built on the octave reduced 7th harmonic if 7/4 is interpreted as a type of seventh, as it forms the interval 33/28- a type of minor third- with the iteration of the 7th harmonic directly below it. I also notice that in 159edo, 33/32 is located further away from the perfect unison than the unison-second as depicted in SHEFKHED interval names- thus qualifying it for designation as a second, even though it is a perfect fifth above 11/8. I do note that 11/8 forms a similar ratio with 7/6. As you can see from the chart, both 8/7 and 7/6 fall into a region designated "Contravaricant", indicating the high likelihood for intervals in this region to act as either seconds or thirds, yet, while 11/8 could rightly be analyzed as a superdiminished fifth, it more commonly functions a fourth relative to the Tonic- particularly outside of Blues music... --Aura (talk) 11:12, 19 September 2020 (UTC)

Optimal Patent Vals for various Quartismic Temperaments

Hey Flora, I see from your recent edits that you appear to know how to find the optimal patent vals for different temperaments... Could you help me find the optimal patent vals for the various Quartismic temperaments? Oh, and could you clean up the EDO lists on the Quartismic family page while you're at it? Thanks. --Aura (talk) 11:33, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

The sequence I originally showed you was that of progressively lower TE error. The last entry is the optimal patent val. FloraC (talk) 12:01, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
That was back when there was only one type of Quartismic temperament, and now we have a whole family of them... --Aura (talk) 12:04, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
I'll look into them when time permits. Now I'm focusing on my own construction, and I'd appreciate it if you help to come up with names. FloraC (talk) 12:18, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
What sorts of names do you want me to come up with? --Aura (talk) 17:03, 3 October 2020 (UTC)
Temperaments. In particular, one that tempers out 896/891 & 472392/471625, an 11-limit extension to canou family. Maybe we talk about it at Talk:Canou family. FloraC (talk) 18:58, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

159edo notation systems

Hey, Flora, what do you think of how this conversation has been going since you last commented on it? --Aura (talk) 16:49, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

spaced interwiki syntax

Your suggestion to add a space after the interwiki prefix for style reasons absolutely makes sense to me. I already added it in Help:Editing #Interwiki links which also announces google searches being available in the same syntax. --Xenwolf (talk) 17:59, 15 October 2020 (UTC)

My Own System

Hey, Flora, I'm busy trying to create my own music system, and also explain how it's different from the Hunt System. I would appreciate feedback on what I have written so far on this. Thanks! --Aura (talk) 12:31, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

I read it, but I prefer not judging it for now. Look, I don't have that 24edo-background as you do; I haven't worked substantially with 11-limit (I'm most experienced with 19edo). My "ideas of tonality" is also under construction – I might take a deeper look at yours after finishing mine. FloraC (talk) 13:08, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
Ah. That makes sense. ---Aura (talk) 08:38, 22 October 2020 (UTC)-Aura (talk) 18:27, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

just approximation tables

When I added a table to 73edo to reflect its mapping to prime (or primary) intervals, I decided to add the approximating steps as well, and decided to stop at 23. It's very similar to the tables you usually add to edo pages, there I found examples with more or less than these columns. What do you think is a reasonable set? Besides your criticism concerning the FJS, wouldn't it be useful to add the fifth span to these tables? (I've to confess that I'm still not able to calculate them) --Xenwolf (talk) 20:27, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

The fifthspan is included for example in 17edo, 19edo, or 53edo. --Xenwolf (talk) 04:16, 20 October 2020 (UTC)
Tbh I don't add the prime limits with specific criteria. I do if I see the prime limit potentially usable in that edo. Neither have I got any formula for fifthspan. FloraC (talk) 05:16, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Another Comma

Hey Flora, I've recently discovered that 19712/19683 is the sum of the quartisma and the nexuma- two commas that I've named- and I see you have this comma on as one of the commas tempered out in some of the various members of the Canou family. I think we need to come up with a name for 19712/19683 now. I mean, I think this will help bring our projects together in a way. --Aura (talk) 15:43, 21 October 2020 (UTC)

I can confirm the nexus comma is indeed an important one in 2.3.11 subgroup. I'm working on projective tuning spaces and hopefully that'll allow a graphical approach to both rastma and nexus comma. Btw I prefer "nexus comma" to "nexuma".
I have to admit "nexuma" is still a pretty cool name- if you know how to pronounce it. That said, I'm definitely keeping "nexus comma" as one of the official names. --Aura (talk) 08:38, 22 October 2020 (UTC)
I also noticed 19712/19683 is a good extension to canou temperament. It identifies 11/8 by 2187/2048 over 9/7. It's tempered out in vishnu, newt, kwai, supers, guiron and amity so I guess it may be called "vishnewt". FloraC (talk) 07:08, 22 October 2020 (UTC)
"Vishnewt" is a funny comma name. However, I'm thinking this comma should have other names for the sake of those who don't want to be left with lingering giggling fits. --Aura (talk) 08:38, 22 October 2020 (UTC)