Talk:Monzo

Pronunciation

I don’t seem to find anywhere how is Joe Monzo’s last name, and monzo the term, are pronounced: with the usual z or with z like in pizza, or in other manner?.. It would certainly aid in translating the term to another language. :) --Arseniiv (talk) 19:11, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

I found Now&Xen Podcast: 038 - Joe Monzo - YouTube - just listening - at some point the correct pronunciation of the name must appear in the video 😉 --Xenwolf (talk) 19:43, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

Oh, thanks! BTW I was planning to listen to the whole series some time but I guess starting with one concrete episode would be a concrete motivation to do that. --Arseniiv (talk) 20:59, 2 November 2020 (UTC)

So it seems my worries were for nothing: z is a usual fricative [z] here! At 3:22 is “Joe Monzo” and at 1:12:13 is “so he called it a monzo”. --Arseniiv (talk) 15:49, 3 November 2020 (UTC)

Coping with large amounts of zeros

There are cases where monzo notation translates simple-to-read ratios into hard-to-read expressions, see for example 19/16. Eliora now introduced a notation that I was thinking about for years: [-4 0⁶ 1⟩ instead of [-4 0 0 0 0 0 0 1⟩. What do others think about it? --Xenwolf (talk) 21:50, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

There are also cases like 29/23 where lots of low-order primes have to be skipped at the beginning. In terms of readability, I would prefer [0⁹ -1 1⟩ to [0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 1⟩. --Xenwolf (talk) 21:59, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

It still involves counting, which ideally should be avoided. I suggest writing out the subgroup explicitly and omit the zeroes. For example, 19/16 is 2.19 [-4 1⟩. FloraC (talk) 13:35, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

I'd like to avoid monzos whose meaning depends on a subgroup prefix. I'm instead thinking of making a Lua module to find prime factors in a given rational number (counting zeros will be automated here). --Xenwolf (talk) 19:11, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

It's a thing, called subgroup monzo (→ Smonzos and svals). FloraC (talk) 00:39, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

I think that the practical applicability differs between monzos and smonzos. Monzo notation is quite easy to understand, even for non-mathematicians. But back to the core problem: shouldn't we create a tool to calculate monzos from fractions or expressions like (5/4)^3/2 ? --Xenwolf (talk) 08:11, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

It doesn't address my concern, that is, readability. FloraC (talk) 09:08, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

(See Val #Vals in JI subgroups on how to write subgroup monzos.) I want to write more compactly, unless we want to consider about subgroup actively. How is [₂-4 ₁₉1⟩ ? (Of course as a temporary way of writing) --Dummy index (talk) 13:05, 30 November 2021 (UTC)

It is too much as it is prime factorization. I feel it is better to include first 4 items without subscript 2, 3, 5 and 7. [-4 0 0 0 ₁₉1⟩, [0 0 0 0 ₂₃-1 ₂₉1⟩.--Dummy index (talk) 14:06, 30 November 2021 (UTC)