Comparison of mode notation systems: Difference between revisions

Wikispaces>TallKite
**Imported revision 580878985 - Original comment: **
Wikispaces>TallKite
**Imported revision 580965555 - Original comment: **
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<h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2>
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: This revision was by author [[User:TallKite|TallKite]] and made on <tt>2016-04-23 02:34:03 UTC</tt>.<br>
: The original revision id was <tt>580878985</tt>.<br>
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The revision contents are below, presented both in the original Wikispaces Wikitext format, and in HTML exactly as Wikispaces rendered it.<br>
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<div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html">GMN notation (genchain mode numbering) is a way to name MOS, MODMOS and even non-MOS rank-2 scales and modes systematically. Like [[xenharmonic/Modal UDP notation|Modal UDP notation]], it starts with the convention of using //some-temperament-name//[//some-number//] to create a generator-chain, and adds a way to number each mode uniquely. For example, here are all the modes of Meantone[7], using ~3/2 as the generator:
<div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html">Mode numbers are a way to name MOS, MODMOS and even non-MOS rank-2 scales and modes systematically. Like [[xenharmonic/Modal UDP notation|Modal UDP notation]], it starts with the convention of using //some-temperament-name//[//some-number//] to create a generator-chain, and adds a way to number each mode uniquely. For example, here are all the modes of Meantone[7], using ~3/2 as the generator:
|| old scale name || new scale name || Ls pattern || example on white keys || genchain ||
|| old scale name || new scale name || Ls pattern || example on white keys || genchain ||
|| Lydian || 1st Meantone[7] || LLLs LLs || F G A B C D E F || __**F**__ C G D A E B ||
|| Lydian || 1st Meantone[7] || LLLs LLs || F G A B C D E F || __**F**__ C G D A E B ||
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F G A C E F, with genchain __**F**__ C G * A E. No amount of altering will make an unbroken genchain, so the name is F 1st Meantone[6] no 6.
F G A C E F, with genchain __**F**__ C G * A E. No amount of altering will make an unbroken genchain, so the name is F 1st Meantone[6] no 6.
==__Explanation / Rationale__==
**__Why not number the modes in the order they occur in the scale?__**
This would order the modes Ionian, Dorian, Phrygian, etc. This is not done in order to group similar modes together, and to show the structure of the temperament.
__**Why make an exception for 3/2 vs 4/3 as the generator?**__
Because of centuries of established thought on the fifth, not the fourth, generating the pythagorean, meantone and well tempered scales, as these quotes show:
"Pythagorean tuning is a tuning of the syntonic temperament in which the &lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;generator&lt;/span&gt; is the ratio **&lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;3:2&lt;/span&gt;**." [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_tuning|en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_tuning]]
"The syntonic temperament is a system of musical tuning in which the frequency ratio of each musical interval is a product of powers of an octave and a tempered perfect **fifth**." [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syntonic_temperament|en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syntonic_temperament]]
"Meantone is constructed the same way as Pythagorean tuning, as a stack of perfect **fifths**"
[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meantone_temperament|en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meantone_temperament]]
"In this system the perfect **fifth** is flattened by one quarter of a syntonic comma" [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-comma_meantone|en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-comma_meantone]]
"Kirnberger I had similarities to &lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;Pythagorean temperament&lt;/span&gt;, which stressed the importance of perfect **fifths** all throughout the circle of **fifths**."
[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirnberger_temperament|en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirnberger_temperament]]
__**Then why not choose the larger of the two generators?**__
Because




==__Why not just use UDP notation?__==  
==__Why not just use UDP notation?__==  
One problem with UDP is that avoiding chroma-negative generators causes the genchain to reverse direction frequently as you lengthen or shorten it. If exploring the various MOS's of a temperament, one has to constantly check the genchain direction.
One problem with UDP is that avoiding chroma-negative generators causes the genchain to reverse direction frequently as you lengthen or shorten it. If exploring the various MOS's of a temperament, one has to constantly check the genchain direction.
|| scale || UDP generator || UDP genchain || GMN generator || GMN genchain ||
|| scale || UDP generator || UDP genchain || Mode Numbers generator || Mode Numbers genchain ||
|| Meantone [2] || 3/2 || C G || 3/2 || C G ||
|| Meantone [2] || 3/2 || C G || 3/2 || C G ||
|| Meantone [3] || 4/3 || D G C || 3/2 || C G D ||
|| Meantone [3] || 4/3 || D G C || 3/2 || C G D ||
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|| Meantone [7] || 3/2 || C G D A E B F# || 3/2 || C G D A E B F# ||
|| Meantone [7] || 3/2 || C G D A E B F# || 3/2 || C G D A E B F# ||


A larger problem is that choosing the chroma-positive generator only applies to MOS and MODMOS scales, and breaks down when the length of the genchain results in a non-MOS scale. GMN notation can be applied to scales like Meantone[8], which while not a MOS, is certainly musically useful.
A larger problem is that choosing the chroma-positive generator only applies to MOS and MODMOS scales, and breaks down when the length of the genchain results in a non-MOS scale. Mode Numbers notation can be applied to scales like Meantone[8], which while not a MOS, is certainly musically useful.
|| scale || UDP genchain || GMN genchain ||
|| scale || UDP genchain || Mode Numbers genchain ||
|| Meantone [2] || C G || C G ||
|| Meantone [2] || C G || C G ||
|| Meantone [3] || D G C || C G D ||
|| Meantone [3] || D G C || C G D ||
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An even larger problem is that Meantone[12] generated by 701¢ has a different genchain than Meantone[12] generated by 699¢, so slight differences in tempering result in different mode names. In other words the notation is overly tuning-dependent. One might address this problem by reasonably constraining meantone's fifth to be less than 700¢. Likewise one could constrain Superpyth[12]'s fifth to be more than 700¢. But this approach fails with Dominant meantone, which tempers out both 81/80 and 64/63, and in which the fifth can reasonably be either more or less than 700¢. This makes every single UDP mode of Dominant[12] ambiguous. For example "Dominant 8|3" could mean either "4th Dominant[12]" or "9th Dominant[12]". Something similar happens with Meantone[19]. If the fifth is greater than 694¢ = 11\19, the generator is 3/2, but if less than 694¢, it's 4/3. This makes every UDP mode of Meantone[19] ambiguous. Another example is Dicot[7] when the neutral 3rd generator is greater or less than 2\7 = 343¢. Another example is Semaphore[5]'s generator of ~8/7 or ~7/6 if near 1\5 = 240¢. In general, this ambiguity arises whenever the generator of an N-note MOS ranges from slightly flat of any N-edo interval to slightly sharp of it.
An even larger problem is that Meantone[12] generated by 701¢ has a different genchain than Meantone[12] generated by 699¢, so slight differences in tempering result in different mode names. In other words the notation is overly tuning-dependent. One might address this problem by reasonably constraining meantone's fifth to be less than 700¢. Likewise one could constrain Superpyth[12]'s fifth to be more than 700¢. But this approach fails with Dominant meantone, which tempers out both 81/80 and 64/63, and in which the fifth can reasonably be either more or less than 700¢. This makes every single UDP mode of Dominant[12] ambiguous. For example "Dominant 8|3" could mean either "4th Dominant[12]" or "9th Dominant[12]". Something similar happens with Meantone[19]. If the fifth is greater than 694¢ = 11\19, the generator is 3/2, but if less than 694¢, it's 4/3. This makes every UDP mode of Meantone[19] ambiguous. Another example is Dicot[7] when the neutral 3rd generator is greater or less than 2\7 = 343¢. Another example is Semaphore[5]'s generator of ~8/7 or ~7/6 if near 1\5 = 240¢. In general, this ambiguity arises whenever the generator of an N-note MOS ranges from slightly flat of any N-edo interval to slightly sharp of it.


A fourth problem with UDP is more of a taste issue: UDP is mathematician-oriented whereas GMN is musician-oriented. For example, the most important piece of information, the number of notes in the scale, is hidden by UDP notation. It must be calculated by adding together the up, down, and period numbers (and the period number is often omitted). Also, as noted above, when comparing different MOS's of a temperament, with GMN but not with UDP, the Nth mode of the smaller MOS is always a subset of the Nth mode of the larger MOS. Furthermore, UDP uses the more mathematical [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-based_numbering|zero-based counting]] and GMN uses the more intuitive one-based counting.
A fourth problem with UDP is more of a taste issue: UDP is mathematician-oriented whereas Mode Numbers notation is musician-oriented. For example, the most important piece of information, the number of notes in the scale, is hidden by UDP notation. It must be calculated by adding together the up, down, and period numbers (and the period number is often omitted). Also, as noted above, when comparing different MOS's of a temperament, with Mode Numbers notation but not with UDP, the Nth mode of the smaller MOS is always a subset of the Nth mode of the larger MOS. Furthermore, UDP uses the more mathematical [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-based_numbering|zero-based counting]] and Mode Numbers notation uses the more intuitive one-based counting.




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Admins: Please delete the blank page at http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/Modal+Notation+by+Genchain+Position</pre></div>
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<div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;width:200%;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html">&lt;html&gt;&lt;head&gt;&lt;title&gt;Naming Rank-2 Scales&lt;/title&gt;&lt;/head&gt;&lt;body&gt;GMN notation (genchain mode numbering) is a way to name MOS, MODMOS and even non-MOS rank-2 scales and modes systematically. Like &lt;a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/Modal%20UDP%20notation"&gt;Modal UDP notation&lt;/a&gt;, it starts with the convention of using &lt;em&gt;some-temperament-name&lt;/em&gt;[&lt;em&gt;some-number&lt;/em&gt;] to create a generator-chain, and adds a way to number each mode uniquely. For example, here are all the modes of Meantone[7], using ~3/2 as the generator:&lt;br /&gt;
<div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;width:200%;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html">&lt;html&gt;&lt;head&gt;&lt;title&gt;Naming Rank-2 Scales&lt;/title&gt;&lt;/head&gt;&lt;body&gt;Mode numbers are a way to name MOS, MODMOS and even non-MOS rank-2 scales and modes systematically. Like &lt;a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/Modal%20UDP%20notation"&gt;Modal UDP notation&lt;/a&gt;, it starts with the convention of using &lt;em&gt;some-temperament-name&lt;/em&gt;[&lt;em&gt;some-number&lt;/em&gt;] to create a generator-chain, and adds a way to number each mode uniquely. For example, here are all the modes of Meantone[7], using ~3/2 as the generator:&lt;br /&gt;




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  As in modal UDP notation, these are written as MOS scales with chromatic alterations. To find the scale's name, start with the genchain for the scale, which will always have gaps. Compact it into a chain without gaps by altering one or more notes. If there is more than one way to do this, the way that alters as few notes as possible is generally preferable. Determine the mode number from the compacted genchain, then add the appropriate alterations.&lt;br /&gt;
  As in modal UDP notation, these are written as MOS scales with chromatic alterations. To find the scale's name, start with the genchain for the scale, which will always have gaps. Compact it into a chain without gaps by altering one or more notes. If there is more than one way to do this, the way that alters as few notes as possible is generally preferable. Determine the mode number from the compacted genchain, then add the appropriate alterations.&lt;br /&gt;


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  Fractional-period rank-2 temperaments have multiple genchains running in parallel. For example, shrutal[10] might look like this:&lt;br /&gt;
  Fractional-period rank-2 temperaments have multiple genchains running in parallel. For example, shrutal[10] might look like this:&lt;br /&gt;
Eb -- Bb -- F --- C --- G&lt;br /&gt;
Eb -- Bb -- F --- C --- G&lt;br /&gt;
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&lt;!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:4:&amp;lt;h2&amp;gt; --&gt;&lt;h2 id="toc2"&gt;&lt;a name="x-Non-MOS non-MODMOS scales"&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:4 --&gt;&lt;!-- ws:start:WikiTextAnchorRule:10:&amp;lt;img src=&amp;quot;/i/anchor.gif&amp;quot; class=&amp;quot;WikiAnchor&amp;quot; alt=&amp;quot;Anchor&amp;quot; id=&amp;quot;wikitext@@anchor@@How to name rank-2 scales-Non-MOS scales&amp;quot; title=&amp;quot;Anchor: How to name rank-2 scales-Non-MOS scales&amp;quot;/&amp;gt; --&gt;&lt;a name="How to name rank-2 scales-Non-MOS scales"&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;!-- ws:end:WikiTextAnchorRule:10 --&gt;&lt;strong&gt;&lt;u&gt;Non-MOS non-MODMOS scales&lt;/u&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/h2&gt;
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  Compact the genchain to remove any gaps via chromatic alterations. The mode number is derived from the compacted genchain. Examples:&lt;br /&gt;
  Compact the genchain to remove any gaps via chromatic alterations. The mode number is derived from the compacted genchain. Examples:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
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&lt;!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:6:&amp;lt;h2&amp;gt; --&gt;&lt;h2 id="toc3"&gt;&lt;a name="x-Why not just use UDP notation?"&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:6 --&gt;&lt;u&gt;Why not just use UDP notation?&lt;/u&gt;&lt;/h2&gt;
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&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;&lt;u&gt;Why not number the modes in the order they occur in the scale?&lt;/u&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
This would order the modes Ionian, Dorian, Phrygian, etc. This is not done in order to group similar modes together, and to show the structure of the temperament.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;u&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Why make an exception for 3/2 vs 4/3 as the generator?&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/u&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
Because of centuries of established thought on the fifth, not the fourth, generating the pythagorean, meantone and well tempered scales, as these quotes show:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Pythagorean tuning is a tuning of the syntonic temperament in which the &lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;generator&lt;/span&gt; is the ratio &lt;strong&gt;&lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;3:2&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;.&amp;quot; &lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_tuning" rel="nofollow"&gt;en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_tuning&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;The syntonic temperament is a system of musical tuning in which the frequency ratio of each musical interval is a product of powers of an octave and a tempered perfect &lt;strong&gt;fifth&lt;/strong&gt;.&amp;quot; &lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syntonic_temperament" rel="nofollow"&gt;en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syntonic_temperament&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Meantone is constructed the same way as Pythagorean tuning, as a stack of perfect &lt;strong&gt;fifths&lt;/strong&gt;&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meantone_temperament" rel="nofollow"&gt;en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meantone_temperament&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;In this system the perfect &lt;strong&gt;fifth&lt;/strong&gt; is flattened by one quarter of a syntonic comma&amp;quot; &lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-comma_meantone" rel="nofollow"&gt;en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-comma_meantone&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;quot;Kirnberger I had similarities to &lt;span class="mw-redirect"&gt;Pythagorean temperament&lt;/span&gt;, which stressed the importance of perfect &lt;strong&gt;fifths&lt;/strong&gt; all throughout the circle of &lt;strong&gt;fifths&lt;/strong&gt;.&amp;quot;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirnberger_temperament" rel="nofollow"&gt;en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirnberger_temperament&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;u&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Then why not choose the larger of the two generators?&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/u&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
Because&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:8:&amp;lt;h2&amp;gt; --&gt;&lt;h2 id="toc4"&gt;&lt;a name="x-Why not just use UDP notation?"&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:8 --&gt;&lt;u&gt;Why not just use UDP notation?&lt;/u&gt;&lt;/h2&gt;
  One problem with UDP is that avoiding chroma-negative generators causes the genchain to reverse direction frequently as you lengthen or shorten it. If exploring the various MOS's of a temperament, one has to constantly check the genchain direction.&lt;br /&gt;
  One problem with UDP is that avoiding chroma-negative generators causes the genchain to reverse direction frequently as you lengthen or shorten it. If exploring the various MOS's of a temperament, one has to constantly check the genchain direction.&lt;br /&gt;


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         &lt;td&gt;UDP genchain&lt;br /&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;UDP genchain&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;GMN generator&lt;br /&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;Mode Numbers generator&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;GMN genchain&lt;br /&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;Mode Numbers genchain&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;
     &lt;/tr&gt;
     &lt;/tr&gt;
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A larger problem is that choosing the chroma-positive generator only applies to MOS and MODMOS scales, and breaks down when the length of the genchain results in a non-MOS scale. GMN notation can be applied to scales like Meantone[8], which while not a MOS, is certainly musically useful.&lt;br /&gt;
A larger problem is that choosing the chroma-positive generator only applies to MOS and MODMOS scales, and breaks down when the length of the genchain results in a non-MOS scale. Mode Numbers notation can be applied to scales like Meantone[8], which while not a MOS, is certainly musically useful.&lt;br /&gt;




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         &lt;td&gt;GMN genchain&lt;br /&gt;
         &lt;td&gt;Mode Numbers genchain&lt;br /&gt;
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An even larger problem is that Meantone[12] generated by 701¢ has a different genchain than Meantone[12] generated by 699¢, so slight differences in tempering result in different mode names. In other words the notation is overly tuning-dependent. One might address this problem by reasonably constraining meantone's fifth to be less than 700¢. Likewise one could constrain Superpyth[12]'s fifth to be more than 700¢. But this approach fails with Dominant meantone, which tempers out both 81/80 and 64/63, and in which the fifth can reasonably be either more or less than 700¢. This makes every single UDP mode of Dominant[12] ambiguous. For example &amp;quot;Dominant 8|3&amp;quot; could mean either &amp;quot;4th Dominant[12]&amp;quot; or &amp;quot;9th Dominant[12]&amp;quot;. Something similar happens with Meantone[19]. If the fifth is greater than 694¢ = 11\19, the generator is 3/2, but if less than 694¢, it's 4/3. This makes every UDP mode of Meantone[19] ambiguous. Another example is Dicot[7] when the neutral 3rd generator is greater or less than 2\7 = 343¢. Another example is Semaphore[5]'s generator of ~8/7 or ~7/6 if near 1\5 = 240¢. In general, this ambiguity arises whenever the generator of an N-note MOS ranges from slightly flat of any N-edo interval to slightly sharp of it.&lt;br /&gt;
An even larger problem is that Meantone[12] generated by 701¢ has a different genchain than Meantone[12] generated by 699¢, so slight differences in tempering result in different mode names. In other words the notation is overly tuning-dependent. One might address this problem by reasonably constraining meantone's fifth to be less than 700¢. Likewise one could constrain Superpyth[12]'s fifth to be more than 700¢. But this approach fails with Dominant meantone, which tempers out both 81/80 and 64/63, and in which the fifth can reasonably be either more or less than 700¢. This makes every single UDP mode of Dominant[12] ambiguous. For example &amp;quot;Dominant 8|3&amp;quot; could mean either &amp;quot;4th Dominant[12]&amp;quot; or &amp;quot;9th Dominant[12]&amp;quot;. Something similar happens with Meantone[19]. If the fifth is greater than 694¢ = 11\19, the generator is 3/2, but if less than 694¢, it's 4/3. This makes every UDP mode of Meantone[19] ambiguous. Another example is Dicot[7] when the neutral 3rd generator is greater or less than 2\7 = 343¢. Another example is Semaphore[5]'s generator of ~8/7 or ~7/6 if near 1\5 = 240¢. In general, this ambiguity arises whenever the generator of an N-note MOS ranges from slightly flat of any N-edo interval to slightly sharp of it.&lt;br /&gt;
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A fourth problem with UDP is more of a taste issue: UDP is mathematician-oriented whereas GMN is musician-oriented. For example, the most important piece of information, the number of notes in the scale, is hidden by UDP notation. It must be calculated by adding together the up, down, and period numbers (and the period number is often omitted). Also, as noted above, when comparing different MOS's of a temperament, with GMN but not with UDP, the Nth mode of the smaller MOS is always a subset of the Nth mode of the larger MOS. Furthermore, UDP uses the more mathematical &lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-based_numbering" rel="nofollow"&gt;zero-based counting&lt;/a&gt; and GMN uses the more intuitive one-based counting.&lt;br /&gt;
A fourth problem with UDP is more of a taste issue: UDP is mathematician-oriented whereas Mode Numbers notation is musician-oriented. For example, the most important piece of information, the number of notes in the scale, is hidden by UDP notation. It must be calculated by adding together the up, down, and period numbers (and the period number is often omitted). Also, as noted above, when comparing different MOS's of a temperament, with Mode Numbers notation but not with UDP, the Nth mode of the smaller MOS is always a subset of the Nth mode of the larger MOS. Furthermore, UDP uses the more mathematical &lt;a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-based_numbering" rel="nofollow"&gt;zero-based counting&lt;/a&gt; and Mode Numbers notation uses the more intuitive one-based counting.&lt;br /&gt;
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