Interseptimal interval: Difference between revisions

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In the theory of [[Margo Schulter]], '''interseptimal''' is a category of [[interval region]]s for [[interval]]s intermediate between two septimal ratios such as [[8/7]] and [[7/6]], or [[12/7]] and [[7/4]]. There are four interseptimal regions given below, with approximate cents ranges from Schulter's essay [http://www.bestii.com/%7Emschulter/IntervalSpectrumRegions.txt ''Regions of the Interval Spectrum'']:
In the theory of [[Margo Schulter]], an '''interseptimal interval''' is an [[interval]] that belongs in one of four [[interval region]]s which are intermediate between two septimal ratios such as [[8/7]] and [[7/6]], or [[12/7]] and [[7/4]]. There are four interseptimal regions given below, with approximate cents ranges from Schulter's essay [http://www.bestii.com/%7Emschulter/IntervalSpectrumRegions.txt ''Regions of the Interval Spectrum'']:


* Maj2–min3 – intermediate between [[8/7]] and [[7/6]] – 240¢–260¢
* Maj2–min3 – intermediate between [[8/7]] and [[7/6]] – 240–260{{c}}
* Maj3–4 – intermediate between [[9/7]] and [[21/16]] – 440¢–468¢
* Maj3–4 – intermediate between [[9/7]] and [[21/16]] – 440–468{{c}}
* 5–min6 – intermediate between [[32/21]] and [[14/9]] – 732¢–760¢
* 5–min6 – intermediate between [[32/21]] and [[14/9]] – 732–760{{c}}
* Maj6–min7 – intermediate between [[12/7]] and [[7/4]] – 940¢–960¢
* Maj6–min7 – intermediate between [[12/7]] and [[7/4]] – 940–960{{c}}


Interseptimal intervals are well-represented in [[24edo]] at 250¢, 450¢, 750¢ and 950¢. They also appear in [[19edo]] and [[29edo]]. As they fall in ambiguous zones between both [[5L 2s|diatonic]] and [[chromatic]] categories, they are inevitably xenharmonic.
Additionally, there are also these 2 interseptimal regions near the unison and octave:
* 1–min2 – intermediate between [[64/63]] and [[28/27]] – 40–60{{c}}
* Maj7-8 – intermediate between [[27/14]] and [[63/32]] – 1140–1160{{c}}
 
Interseptimal intervals are well-represented in [[24edo]] at 250{{c}}, 450{{c}}, 750{{c}}, and 950{{c}}. They also appear in [[19edo]] and [[29edo]]. As they fall in ambiguous zones between both [[5L 2s|diatonic]] and [[chromatic]] categories, they are inevitably xenharmonic.


A JI-agnostic synonym is '''interordinal'''; here, ''ordinal'' refers to the [[interval class]]es of the diatonic scale the interordinal intervals lie between, conventionally denoted with ordinal numbers.  
A JI-agnostic synonym is '''interordinal'''; here, ''ordinal'' refers to the [[interval class]]es of the diatonic scale the interordinal intervals lie between, conventionally denoted with ordinal numbers.  
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One option is to give each region a distinct name (analogous to using the word ''tritone'' rather than diminished fifth or augmented fourth). Possible names that could be used are:
One option is to give each region a distinct name (analogous to using the word ''tritone'' rather than diminished fifth or augmented fourth). Possible names that could be used are:
* 240¢–260¢ – '''semifourth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a perfect fourth.
* 240¢–260¢ – '''semifourth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a perfect fourth.
** The term '''chthonic''' (from ''khthon'', an ancient Greek word referring to spirits of the underworld) refers to the 240-260¢ region by [[Zhea Erose]].<ref>As per [[Primodal Archive]].</ref>
** The term '''chthonic''' (from ''khthon'', an ancient Greek word referring to spirits of the underworld) refers to the 240–260{{c}} region by [[Zhea Erose]].<ref group="note">As per [[Primodal Archive]].</ref>
* 440¢–468¢ – '''semisixth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a major sixth.
* 440¢–468¢ – '''semisixth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a major sixth.
** The term '''naiadic''' (from ''naiad'', a kind of ancient Greek water spirit) refers to the 440–464¢ region by [[Zhea Erose]], who uses it frequently.
** The term '''naiadic''' (from ''naiad'', a kind of ancient Greek water spirit) refers to the 440–464{{c}} region by [[Zhea Erose]], who uses it frequently.
* 732¢–760¢ – '''semitenth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a minor tenth (i. e., an octave plus a minor third). Another possible name is sesquifourth (since this is also about one and a half times the size of a perfect fourth).
* 732¢–760¢ – '''semitenth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a minor tenth (i. e., an octave plus a minor third). Another possible name is sesquifourth (since this is also about one and a half times the size of a perfect fourth).
** The term '''cocytic''' was proposed by [[Inthar]], by analogy with ''naiadic''.
** The term '''cocytic''' was proposed by [[Inthar]], by analogy with ''naiadic''.
* 940¢–960¢ – '''semitwelfth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a perfect twelfth (i.e. a compound perfect fifth, or tritave). All even [[edt]]s have a semitwelfth of approximately 951 cents, analogous to the 600 cent tritone shared by all even edos.
* 940¢–960¢ – '''semitwelfth''' – an interval of this size is around half the size of a perfect twelfth (i.e. a compound perfect fifth, or tritave). All even [[edt]]s have a semitwelfth of approximately 951{{c}}, analogous to the 600{{c}} tritone shared by all even edos.
** The term '''ouranic''' (by analogy with chthonic, and to match with the other terms) is proposed by [[User:Kaiveran|Kaiveran]].
** The term '''ouranic''' (by analogy with chthonic, and to match with the other terms) is proposed by [[User:Kaiveran|Kaiveran]].


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Since interseptimal intervals are typically well represented by any [[EDO]] or [[pergen]] that divides its approximate 3/1 into 2''n'' parts, another option is to repurpose [[24edo#Quartertone Accidentals|quartertone accidentals]] to represent them, which is easy as long as we define our "half-sharps" or "half-flats" to be precisely half of a chromatic semitone. With this in mind, we get the following twinned identities for our interseptimals, with the simplest ones (assuming a half-fifth genchain) listed first:
Since interseptimal intervals are typically well represented by any [[EDO]] or [[pergen]] that divides its approximate 3/1 into 2''n'' parts, another option is to repurpose [[24edo#Quartertone Accidentals|quartertone accidentals]] to represent them, which is easy as long as we define our "half-sharps" or "half-flats" to be precisely half of a chromatic semitone. With this in mind, we get the following twinned identities for our interseptimals, with the simplest ones (assuming a half-fifth genchain) listed first:


* semifourth/chthonic = semi-augmented second (+11/2), semi-diminished third (-13/2)
* semifourth/chthonic = semi-augmented second (+11/2), semi-diminished third (−13/2)
* semisixth/naiadic = semi-diminished fourth (-9/2), semi-augmented third (+15/2)
* semisixth/naiadic = semi-diminished fourth (−9/2), semi-augmented third (+15/2)
* semitenth/cocytic = semi-augmented fifth (+9/2), semi-diminished sixth (-15/2)
* semitenth/cocytic = semi-augmented fifth (+9/2), semi-diminished sixth (−15/2)
* semitwelfth/ouranic = semi-diminished seventh (-11/2), semi-augmented sixth (+13/2)
* semitwelfth/ouranic = semi-diminished seventh (−11/2), semi-augmented sixth (+13/2)


While this does not give the interseptimals a single distinct ''notational'' name, it does reflect their ambiguity and flexibility with regards to the surrounding interval categories that many are so fond of. Furthermore, as both identities are exactly 12 notational fifths apart (i.e a direct analogue of the [[Pythagorean comma]]), composers can use a mechanism similar to the [[Color notation|"po and qu" of Color Notation]], or the plus and minus accidentals (+/-) proposed in [[Rational Comma Notation (RCN)|Rational Comma Notation]], to freely switch between the two identities.
While this does not give the interseptimals a single distinct ''notational'' name, it does reflect their ambiguity and flexibility with regards to the surrounding interval categories that many are so fond of. Furthermore, as both identities are exactly 12 notational fifths apart (i.e a direct analogue of the [[Pythagorean comma]]), composers can use a mechanism similar to the [[Color notation|"po and qu" of Color Notation]], or the plus and minus accidentals (+/) proposed in [[Rational Comma Notation (RCN)|Rational Comma Notation]], to freely switch between the two identities.


Alternatively, one can use the ''ultra-'' prefix for sharpening by ~50¢ and ''infra-'' for flattening by ~50¢, analogous to ''super-'' and ''sub-'' for modifications by [[64/63]] (in a [[12edo]]-related context such as [[36edo]], 33¢).
Alternatively, one can use the ''ultra-'' prefix for sharpening by ~50¢ and ''infra-'' for flattening by ~50{{c}}, analogous to ''super-'' and ''sub-'' for modifications by ~30{{c}}.
* semifourth/chthonic = ultramajor second, inframinor third
* semifourth/chthonic = ultramajor second, inframinor third
* semisixth/naiadic = ultramajor third, infrafourth
* semisixth/naiadic = ultramajor third, infrafourth
* semitenth/cocytic = ultrafifth, inframinor sixth
* semitenth/cocytic = ultrafifth, inframinor sixth
* semitwelfth/ouranic = ultramajor sixth, inframinor seventh
* semitwelfth/ouranic = ultramajor sixth, inframinor seventh
''Ultra-'' and ''infra-'' also work for intervals that are very close to 11/8 or 16/11:
''Ultra-'' and ''infra-'' also work for intervals that are very close to 11/8 or 16/11:
* ~11/8 or ~550¢ = ultrafourth, infratritone, infrasemioctave
* ~11/8 or ~550{{c}} = ultrafourth, infratritone, infrasemioctave
* ~16/11 or ~650¢ = infrafifth, ultratritone, ultrasemioctave
* ~16/11 or ~650{{c}} = infrafifth, ultratritone, ultrasemioctave


=== "Inter" names ===
=== "Inter" names ===
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* semitenth/cocytic = fifth-inter-sixth (5×6)
* semitenth/cocytic = fifth-inter-sixth (5×6)
* semitwelfth/ouranic = sixth-inter-seventh (6×7)
* semitwelfth/ouranic = sixth-inter-seventh (6×7)
=== "Plus" names ===
To combine intuitiveness with conciseness, Kite Giedraitis has proposed using "plus" to indicate interordinals.
* semifourth = plus-second (+2nd or +2)
* semisixth = plus-third (+3rd or +3)
* semitenth = plus-fifth (+5th or +5)
* semitwelfth = plus-sixth (+6th or +6)
See [[User:TallKite/Midpoints]] (work in progress).
=== Decimal ordinal names ===
CompactStar has proposed names using decimal ordinals to indicate how these fall between diatonic categories:
* semifourth/chthonic = 2.5th
* semisixth/naiadic = 3.5th
* semitenth/cocytic = 5.5th
* semitwelfth/ouranic = 6.5th


=== Within a pentatonic framework ===
=== Within a pentatonic framework ===
A pentatonic framework, as elucidated in Kite Giedraitis's [http://www.tallkite.com/AlternativeTunings.html Alternative Tuning guide], is far more amenable to interseptimal intervals than the traditional Western heptatonic framework.
A pentatonic framework, as elucidated in Kite Giedraitis's [http://www.tallkite.com/AlternativeTunings.html Alternative Tuning guide], is far more amenable to interseptimal intervals than the traditional Western heptatonic framework. Such a framework is also discussed on the page [[Pentatonic Functional Just System]].


{| class="wikitable"
{| class="wikitable"
|+The pentatonic framework
|+ style="font-size: 105%;" | The pentatonic framework
! colspan="2" | names
|-
! quality
! colspan="2" | Names
! boundaries
! Quality
! colspan="2" | heptatonic equivalent
! Boundaries
! colspan="2" | Heptatonic equivalent
|-
|-
| rowspan="3" | 1sn
| rowspan="3" | 1sn
| rowspan="3" | unison
| rowspan="3" | Unison
| perfect
| Perfect
| 1/1 to 64/63
| 1/1 to 64/63
| perfect
| Perfect
| 1sn
| 1sn
|-
|-
| half-augmented
| Half-augmented
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| augmented
| Augmented
| 28/27 to 16/15
| 28/27 to 16/15
| minor
| Minor
| rowspan="3" |2nd
| rowspan="3" | 2nd
|-
|-
! colspan="3" |
! colspan="3" |  
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| neutral
| Neutral
|-
|-
| rowspan="3" | penta-2nd
| rowspan="3" | Penta-2nd
| rowspan="3" | subthird
| rowspan="3" | Subthird
| minor
| Minor
| 10/9 to 8/7
| 10/9 to 8/7
| major
| Major
|-
|-
| neutral
| Neutral
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| major
| Major
| 7/6 to 6/5
| 7/6 to 6/5
| minor
| Minor
| rowspan="3" | 3rd
| rowspan="3" | 3rd
|-
|-
! colspan="3" |
! colspan="3" |  
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| neutral
| Neutral
|-
|-
| rowspan="5" | penta-3rd
| rowspan="5" | Penta-3rd
| rowspan="5" | fourthoid
| rowspan="5" | Fourthoid
| diminished
| Diminished
| 5/4 to 9/7
| 5/4 to 9/7
| major
| Major
|-
|-
| half-diminished
| Half-diminished
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| perfect
| Perfect
| 21/16 to 27/20
| 21/16 to 27/20
| perfect
| perfect
| rowspan="3" | 4th
| rowspan="3" | 4th
|-
|-
| half-augmented
| Half-augmented
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| half-augmented
| Half-augmented
|-
|-
| augmented
| Augmented
| rowspan="2" |7/5 to 10/7
| rowspan="2" | 7/5 to 10/7
| augmented
| Augmented
|-
|-
| rowspan="5" | penta-4th
| rowspan="5" | Penta-4th
| rowspan="5" | fifthoid
| rowspan="5" | Fifthoid
| diminished
| Diminished
| diminished
| Diminished
| rowspan="3" | 5th
| rowspan="3" | 5th
|-
|-
| half-diminished
| Half-diminished
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| half-diminished
| Half-diminished
|-
|-
| perfect
| Perfect
| 40/27 to 32/21
| 40/27 to 32/21
| perfect
| Perfect
|-
|-
| half-augmented
| Half-augmented
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| augmented
| Augmented
| 14/9 to 8/5
| 14/9 to 8/5
| minor
| Minor
| rowspan="3" | 6th
| rowspan="3" | 6th
|-
|-
! colspan="3" |
! colspan="3" |  
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| neutral
| Neutral
|-
|-
| rowspan="3" |penta-5th
| rowspan="3" | Penta-5th
| rowspan="3" |subseventh
| rowspan="3" | Subseventh
| minor
| Minor
| 5/3 to 12/7
| 5/3 to 12/7
| major
| Major
|-
|-
| neutral
| Neutral
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| major
| Major
| 7/4 to 9/5
| 7/4 to 9/5
| minor
| Minor
| rowspan="3" |7th
| rowspan="3" | 7th
|-
|-
! colspan="3" |
! colspan="3" |  
| (interpental)
| (Interpental)
| neutral
| Neutral
|-
|-
| rowspan="3" | hexave
| rowspan="3" | Hexave
| rowspan="3" | octoid
| rowspan="3" | Octoid
| diminished
| Diminished
| 15/8 to 27/14
| 15/8 to 27/14
| major
| Major
|-
|-
| half-diminished
| Half-diminished
| (interseptimal)
| (Interseptimal)
! colspan="2" |
! colspan="2" |  
|-
|-
| perfect
| Perfect
| 63/32 to 2/1
| 63/32 to 2/1
| perfect
| Perfect
| 8ve
| 8ve
|}
|}
Note the two additional interseptimal regions. The boundary ratios are mostly either 81/80 or 64/63 away from a 3-limit interval. The exceptions are 7/5 and 10/7, which are only a [[5120/5103|Saruyo]] comma away from the 3-limit diminished 5th and augmented 4th respectively.  
Note the two additional interseptimal regions. The boundary ratios are mostly either 81/80 or 64/63 away from a 3-limit interval. The exceptions are 7/5 and 10/7, which are only a [[5120/5103|Saruyo]] comma away from the 3-limit diminished 5th and augmented 4th respectively.  


Interseptimal intervals are now easily named. However there are now hard-to-name "interpental" intervals which would be neutral intervals in the heptatonic framework, containing such ratios as 12/11, 11/9, etc. This is because interseptimal intervals are the neutral intervals with respect to the parent [[mos]] [[2L 3s]] of the diatonic mos [[5L 2s]].
Interseptimal intervals are now easily named. However there are now hard-to-name "interpental" intervals which would be neutral intervals in the heptatonic framework, containing such ratios as 12/11, 11/9, etc. This is because interseptimal intervals are the neutral intervals with respect to the parent [[mos]] [[2L&nbsp;3s]] of the diatonic mos [[5L&nbsp;2s]].


So composing in a pentatonic framework may allow interseptimal intervals to play much more pivotal roles than usual.
Thus composing in a pentatonic framework may allow interseptimal intervals to play much more pivotal roles than usual.


== Examples ==
== Examples ==
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=== Maj2–min3 (semifourth/chthonic) ===
=== Maj2–min3 (semifourth/chthonic) ===
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
|-
! Interval
! Interval
! Cents Value
! Size<br />(cents)
! Prime Limit (if applicable)
! Prime limit<br />(if applicable)
|-
|-
| [[147/128]]
| [[147/128]]
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| 1\[[5edo|5]]
| 1\[[5edo|5]]
| 240.000
| 240.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| 54/47
| 54/47
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| 6\[[29edo|29]]
| 6\[[29edo|29]]
| 248.276
| 248.276
| -
|
|-
|-
| 5\[[24edo|24]]
| 5\[[24edo|24]]
| 250.000
| 250.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[52/45]]
| [[52/45]]
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| 4\[[19edo|19]]
| 4\[[19edo|19]]
| 252.632
| 252.632
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[22/19]]
| [[22/19]]
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| 3\[[14edo|14]]
| 3\[[14edo|14]]
| 257.143
| 257.143
| -
|
|-
|-
| 297/256
| 297/256
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| 5\[[23edo|23]]
| 5\[[23edo|23]]
| 260.870
| 260.870
| -
|
|}
|}


=== Maj3–4 (semisixth/naiadic) ===
=== Maj3–4 (semisixth/naiadic) ===
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
|-
! Interval
! Interval
! Cents Value
! Size<br />(cents)
! Prime Limit (if applicable)
! Prime limit<br />(if applicable)
|-
|-
| 5\[[88cET]] or 11\[[30edo|30]]
| 5\[[88cET]] or 11\[[30edo|30]]
| 440.000
| 440.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[40/31]]
| [[40/31]]
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| 7\[[19edo|19]]
| 7\[[19edo|19]]
| 442.015
| 442.015
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[31/24]]
| [[31/24]]
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| 10\[[27edo|27]]
| 10\[[27edo|27]]
| 444.444
| 444.444
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[22/17]]
| [[22/17]]
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| 3\[[8edo|8]]
| 3\[[8edo|8]]
| 450.000
| 450.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| 48/37
| 48/37
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| 11\[[29edo|29]]
| 11\[[29edo|29]]
| 455.172
| 455.172
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[125/96]]
| [[125/96]]
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| 8\[[21edo|21]]
| 8\[[21edo|21]]
| 457.143
| 457.143
| -
|
|-
|-
| 56/43
| 56/43
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| 5\[[13edo|13]]
| 5\[[13edo|13]]
| 461.538
| 461.538
| -
|
|-
|-
| 47/36
| 47/36
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| 12\[[31edo|31]]
| 12\[[31edo|31]]
| 464.516
| 464.516
| -
|
|-
|-
| 7\[[18edo|18]]
| 7\[[18edo|18]]
| 466.667
| 466.667
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[38/29]]
| [[38/29]]
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=== 5–min6 (semitenth/cocytic) ===
=== 5–min6 (semitenth/cocytic) ===
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
|-
! Interval
! Interval
! Cents Value
! Size<br />(cents)
! Prime Limit (if applicable)
! Prime limit<br />(if applicable)
|-
|-
| 5\[[Bohlen-Pierce]]
| 5\[[13edt]]
| 731.521
| 731.521
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[29/19]]
| [[29/19]]
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| 11\[[18edo|18]]
| 11\[[18edo|18]]
| 733.333
| 733.333
| -
|
|-
|-
| 19\[[31edo|31]]
| 19\[[31edo|31]]
| 735.484
| 735.484
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[26/17]]
| [[26/17]]
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| 13\[[21edo|21]]
| 13\[[21edo|21]]
| 742.857
| 742.857
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[182/125]]
| [[182/125]]
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| 18\[[29edo|29]]
| 18\[[29edo|29]]
| 744.828
| 744.828
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[20/13]]
| [[20/13]]
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| 5\[[8edo|8]]
| 5\[[8edo|8]]
| 750.000
| 750.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[54/35]]
| [[54/35]]
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| 17\[[27edo|27]]
| 17\[[27edo|27]]
| 755.556
| 755.556
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[48/31]]
| [[48/31]]
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| 12\[[19edo|19]]
| 12\[[19edo|19]]
| 757.895
| 757.895
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[31/20]]
| [[31/20]]
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| 19\[[30edo|30]]
| 19\[[30edo|30]]
| 760.000
| 760.000
| -
|
|}
|}


=== Maj6–min7 (semitwelfth/ouranic) ===
=== Maj6–min7 (semitwelfth/ouranic) ===
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
{| class="wikitable center-1 right-2"
|-
! Interval
! Interval
! Cents Value
! Size<br />(cents)
! Prime Limit (if applicable)
! Prime limit<br />(if applicable)
|-
|-
| 18\[[23edo|23]]
| 18\[[23edo|23]]
| 939.130
| 939.130
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[31/18]]
| [[31/18]]
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| 11\[[14edo|14]]
| 11\[[14edo|14]]
| 942.857
| 942.857
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[50/29]]
| [[50/29]]
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| 15\[[19edo|19]]
| 15\[[19edo|19]]
| 947.368
| 947.368
| -
|
|-
|-
| 64/37
| 64/37
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| 19\[[24edo|24]]
| 19\[[24edo|24]]
| 950.000
| 950.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| 23\[[29edo|29]]
| 23\[[29edo|29]]
| 951.724
| 951.724
| -
|
|-
|-
| [[26/15]]
| [[26/15]]
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| 4\[[5edo|5]]
| 4\[[5edo|5]]
| 960.000
| 960.000
| -
|
|-
|-
| 256/147
| 256/147
Line 588: Line 611:


== Notes ==
== Notes ==
<references group="note" />
{{Navbox intervals}}


[[Category:Interseptimal intervals| ]]
[[Category:Interseptimal intervals| ]]