Talk:Kite's color notation: Difference between revisions

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 == Possible "de-heptatonicization" of colorspeak ==
 Color notation uses the conventional heptatonic degrees 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. It's possible to avoid this by using "wo" and "wu" to mean 3-over and 3-under. Thus 10/9 would be not "yo 2nd" but "yowuwu". 27/16 would be "triwo". The Ptolomaic scale would be wa, wowo, yo, wu, wo, yowu, yowo, cowa. Presumably this would free up one's thinking, but one would lose the rough estimate of an interval's size that the degree provides, and it would be difficult to tell how big something like zoguwuwu is. I don't personally recommend this notation, just noting the possibility here. --[[User:TallKite|TallKite]] ([[User talk:TallKite|talk]]) 06:17, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
+== Possible simplification of colorspeak ==
+Primes 5 and 7 could be treated just like primes 11 and higher. Yo/gu/ya could become fo/fu/fa, and zo/ru/za could become so/su/(i)sa. This necessitates changing the prime 17 syllables from so/su/sa to something else, probably zo/zu/za. It also necessitates changing the forty- prefix from fo- to for-. Thus 41, 43 and 47 must become forwo, fortho and forso. Finally, sep- for septuple can become se-.
+{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center"
+|+
+!prime
+! colspan="2" |-o ("oh") for over
+! colspan="2" |-u ("oo") for under
+! colspan="2" |-a ("ah") for all
+! colspan="2" |-e ("eh") for exponent
+|-
+|2
+| colspan="2" |—
+| colspan="2" |—
+| colspan="2" |—
+|bi ("bee")
+|double
+|-
+|3
+| colspan="2" |—
+| colspan="2" |—
+|wa
+|—
+|tri ("tree")
+|triple
+|-
+| colspan="7" |
+|quad
+|quadruple
+|-
+| 5
+|fo
+|5o
+| fu
+| 5u
+|fa
+| 5a
+| quin
+| quintuple
+|-
+|7
+|(i)so
+|7o
+|su
+|7u
+| (i)sa
+| 7a
+|se
+|septuple
+|-
+|11
+|(i)lo
+|1o
+|lu
+| 1u
+|(i)la
+|1a
+|le
+|11-fold
+|-
+|13
+|tho
+|3o
+|thu
+|3u
+|tha
+|3a
+|the
+|13-fold
+|-
+|17
+|zo
+|17o
+|zu
+|17u
+|za
+|17a
+|ze
+|17-fold
+|-
+|19
+|(i)no
+|19o
+|(i)nu
+|19u
+|na
+|19a
+|ne
+|19-fold
+|-
+|23
+|twetho
+|23o
+|twethu
+|23u
+|twetha
+| 23a
+|twethe
+|23-fold
+|}
+The 4:5:6 chord would change from Cy to C5o. Unfortunately this looks like a thirdless C chord with a flat 5th. Not a huge problem, since one can get used to it, but C5o is certainly jarring at first. Same with 6:7:9 becoming C7o which looks a lot like Co7, the conventional dim7 chord. Likewise there's C5o7 and C7o7. Another solution is to write Cfo, Cfo7, Cso and Cso7. (BTW this is why 11-over is abbreviated 1o not 11o, and 13-over is 3o not 13o. To avoid 11-limit or 13-limit triads looking like 11th chords or 13th chords.)
+The letter s gets used more frequently, perhaps overloading it slightly. For example the Sasaru comma (Ru minus Lalawa) becomes Sasasu = ss7u.
+The term "color" is still useful and would be retained to refer to any "row" of the JI lattice formed by a chain of 5ths. One could still talk about bicolored vs tricolored chords and scales. Thus the name of the notation would remain color notation or colorspeak.
+Advantages:
+* More logical, easier to learn.
+* Much better for speakers of languages that don't distinguish between r and l.
+Disadvantages:
+* The rainbow metaphor gets lost. (But it breaks down at some point with higher primes anyway.)
+* Widely used 7-limit colors become less concise: y -> 5o, yy -> 5oo, zg -> 7o5u, etc. Thus staff music becomes more cluttered and chord names become longer.
+* The 7-limit comma names become more "same-y", with s and f replacing y, g, z and r.
+* The 4:5:6 triad becomes C5o, which looks like a diminished dyad. (Or it becomes Cfo.)
+* The 6:7:9 triad becomes C7o, which looks like a dim 7th chord. (Or it becomes Cso.)
+* Fa, the new word for five-all i.e. 5-limit, sounds like the solfege word Fa.
+* The current nomenclature is widely used in the xenwiki and various apps.
+--[[User:TallKite|TallKite]] ([[User talk:TallKite|talk]]) 06:50, 3 August 2024 (UTC)