User talk:Lhearne: Difference between revisions

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::: I'm not sure I like "whopper"/"wheeny", "weird". They don't sound 'serious' enough for me. I also disagree that ambiguity on the generic diatonic interval class of an interval means we don't use it at all as a prefix to a (pythagorean) diatonic interval. If, for example, 7/4 can be both a type of seven and type of six, then we need to be able to notate it as both ideally. Moreover, 7/4 has been considered a type of seventh for hundreds of years and is rather well accepted as a subminor seventh. Do you intend to do away with super and sub as well? Yes, 11/8 is a type of fourth, and that means that 14/11 is a type of fourth, and that clashes with 14/11 being considered instead a type of third, but these sorts of ambiguities are unavoidable when we're trying to use a Pythagorean lattice to get to all of JI. Most people will tell us we shouldn't even bother trying, but I wish they were more encouraging, as an aside...

::: I've left behind M1 and m8 very quickly after suggesting it haha --[[User:Lhearne|Lhearne]] ([[User talk:Lhearne|talk]]) 02:57, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

:::: To be frank, even though "whopper" and "wheeny" don't feel all that serious, I kind of feel the same way about "bright/baby", but I'm still willing to work with these as needed. Perhaps we should dig through the thesaurus to come up with better letters and corresponding interval modifier names...

:::: On another note, now that you have explained things a bit more, I do agree that we need to be able to notate 7/4 as both a subminor seventh and as a sort of sixth, as that reflects the functional realities concerning that interval. I do not intend to do away with super and sub, though do I think we need to come up with a more consistent strategy for reflecting the functional realities. To that end, I propose that we restrict the arithmetic ambiguities to primes that are more readily characterized by equivalent functional ambiguities, such as the 7-prime. For instance, the pentacircle comma allows us to access the functionality of 7/4 as a third relative to 11/8, and thus, as a sixth, while the Archytas' Subchroma allows us access to 7/4 when it acts as a subminor seventh- yes, I'm calling 64/63 "Archytas' Subchroma" for the moment because it often does have a sort of chromatic function when not treated as a comma. I hope this idea makes more sense. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 00:03, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

== Notation and Well-Ordered Naming Systems ==

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: 81/80: k^, kv; ḱ, ķ

: 416/405: h^, hv; ĥ, ḫ --[[User:Lhearne|Lhearne]] ([[User talk:Lhearne|talk]]) 03:34, 23 February 2021 (UTC)

:: I'm glad you like this idea. For the record, the way these glyphs are combined is that the rastmic/syntonic arrow symbol is placed before the conventional/quartertone accidental in a horizontal arrangement which can be compared to how letters get together to form words. I hope this makes more sense. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 00:03, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

@@ Line 177: / Line 177: @@
 ::: I'm not sure I like "whopper"/"wheeny", "weird". They don't sound 'serious' enough for me. I also disagree that ambiguity on the generic diatonic interval class of an interval means we don't use it at all as a prefix to a (pythagorean) diatonic interval. If, for example, 7/4 can be both a type of seven and type of six, then we need to be able to notate it as both ideally. Moreover, 7/4 has been considered a type of seventh for hundreds of years and is rather well accepted as a subminor seventh. Do you intend to do away with super and sub as well? Yes, 11/8 is a type of fourth, and that means that 14/11 is a type of fourth, and that clashes with 14/11 being considered instead a type of third, but these sorts of ambiguities are unavoidable when we're trying to use a Pythagorean lattice to get to all of JI. Most people will tell us we shouldn't even bother trying, but I wish they were more encouraging, as an aside...
 ::: I've left behind M1 and m8 very quickly after suggesting it haha --[[User:Lhearne|Lhearne]] ([[User talk:Lhearne|talk]]) 02:57, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
+:::: To be frank, even though "whopper" and "wheeny" don't feel all that serious, I kind of feel the same way about "bright/baby", but I'm still willing to work with these as needed.  Perhaps we should dig through the thesaurus to come up with better letters and corresponding interval modifier names...
+:::: On another note, now that you have explained things a bit more, I do agree that we need to be able to notate 7/4 as both a subminor seventh and as a sort of sixth, as that reflects the functional realities concerning that interval.  I do not intend to do away with super and sub, though do I think we need to come up with a more consistent strategy for reflecting the functional realities.  To that end, I propose that we restrict the arithmetic ambiguities to primes that are more readily characterized by equivalent functional ambiguities, such as the 7-prime.  For instance, the pentacircle comma allows us to access the functionality of 7/4 as a third relative to 11/8, and thus, as a sixth, while the Archytas' Subchroma allows us access to 7/4 when it acts as a subminor seventh- yes, I'm calling 64/63 "Archytas' Subchroma" for the moment because it often does have a sort of chromatic function when not treated as a comma.  I hope this idea makes more sense. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 00:03, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
 == Notation and Well-Ordered Naming Systems ==
@@ Line 227: / Line 231: @@
 : 81/80: k^, kv; ḱ, ķ
 : 416/405: h^, hv; ĥ, ḫ --[[User:Lhearne|Lhearne]] ([[User talk:Lhearne|talk]]) 03:34, 23 February 2021 (UTC)
+:: I'm glad you like this idea.  For the record, the way these glyphs are combined is that the rastmic/syntonic arrow symbol is placed before the conventional/quartertone accidental in a horizontal arrangement which can be compared to how letters get together to form words.  I hope this makes more sense. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 00:03, 24 February 2021 (UTC)