34edo: Difference between revisions
Wikispaces>Kosmorsky **Imported revision 469917004 - Original comment: ** |
Wikispaces>Kosmorsky **Imported revision 470061452 - Original comment: ** |
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<h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | <h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | ||
This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | ||
: This revision was by author [[User:Kosmorsky|Kosmorsky]] and made on <tt>2013-11- | : This revision was by author [[User:Kosmorsky|Kosmorsky]] and made on <tt>2013-11-18 10:48:15 UTC</tt>.<br> | ||
: The original revision id was <tt> | : The original revision id was <tt>470061452</tt>.<br> | ||
: The revision comment was: <tt></tt><br> | : The revision comment was: <tt></tt><br> | ||
The revision contents are below, presented both in the original Wikispaces Wikitext format, and in HTML exactly as Wikispaces rendered it.<br> | The revision contents are below, presented both in the original Wikispaces Wikitext format, and in HTML exactly as Wikispaces rendered it.<br> | ||
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===Approximations to Just Intonation=== | ===Approximations to Just Intonation=== | ||
Like [[xenharmonic/17edo|17edo]], 34edo contains good approximations of just intervals involving 13 and 3 -- specifically, 13/8, 13/12, 13/9 and their inversions -- while failing to closely approximate ratios of 7 or 11. 34edo adds ratios of 5 into the mix -- including 5/4, 6/5, 9/5, 15/8, 13/10, 15/13, and their inversions -- as well as 17 -- including 17/16, 18/17, 17/12, 17/10, 17/13, 17/15 and their inversions. Since it distinguishes between 9/8 and 10/9 (exaggerating the difference between them, the syntonic comma of 81/80, from 21.5 cents to 35.3 cents), it is suitable for 5-limit JI. It is not a [[xenharmonic/meantone|meantone ]]system. | Like [[xenharmonic/17edo|17edo]], 34edo contains good approximations of just intervals involving 13 and 3 -- specifically, 13/8, 13/12, 13/9 and their inversions -- while failing to closely approximate ratios of 7 or 11.* 34edo adds ratios of 5 into the mix -- including 5/4, 6/5, 9/5, 15/8, 13/10, 15/13, and their inversions -- as well as 17 -- including 17/16, 18/17, 17/12, 17/10, 17/13, 17/15 and their inversions. Since it distinguishes between 9/8 and 10/9 (exaggerating the difference between them, the "syntonic comma" of 81/80, from 21.5 cents to 35.3 cents), it is suitable for 5-limit JI. It is not a [[xenharmonic/meantone|meantone ]]system. In layman's terms while no number of fifths (frequently ratios of ~3:2) land on major or minor thirds, an even number of major or minor thirds, technically will be the same pitch as something, somewhere upon the cycle of seventeen fifths. | ||
//Viewed in light of Western diatonic theory, the three extra steps (of 34-et compared to 31-et) in effect widen the intervals between C and D, F and G, and A and B [that is: 6 5 3 6 5 6 3], thus making a distinction between major tones, ratio 9/8 and minor tones, ratio 10/9.// ([[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34_equal_temperament|Wikipedia]]) | //Viewed in light of Western diatonic theory, the three extra steps (of 34-et compared to 31-et) in effect widen the intervals between C and D, F and G, and A and B [that is: 6 5 3 6 5 6 3], thus making a distinction between major tones, ratio 9/8 and minor tones, ratio 10/9.// ([[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34_equal_temperament|Wikipedia]]) | ||
*The sharpness of ~13 cents of 11/8 can fit somewhat with the 9/8 and 13/8 which both are about 7 cents sharp. Likewise the 20-cent sharpness or flatness of either approximation to 7/4 isn't impossible. The ability to tolerate these errors may depend on subtle natural changes in mood. [[68edo]], double 34, has both these intervals in more perfect form, the 7 especially so. | |||
===34edo and phi=== | ===34edo and phi=== | ||
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of the full [[xenharmonic/17-limit|17-limit]] || pseudo-traditional | of the full [[xenharmonic/17-limit|17-limit]] || pseudo-traditional | ||
notation || | notation || | ||
|| 0 || do || 0.0 || 1/1 || || C || | || 0 || do || 0.0 || 1/1 || || C = B^^ = A## || | ||
|| 1 || di || 35.294 || || || C ^ || | || 1 || di || 35.294 || || || C ^ || | ||
|| 2 || rih || 70.588 || || || Db = C ^^ = B# || | || 2 || rih || 70.588 || || || Db = C ^^ = B# || | ||
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|| 33 || da || 1164.706 || || || B^ = A##v || | || 33 || da || 1164.706 || || || B^ = A##v || | ||
==<span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Notations</span>== | ==<span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Notations</span>== | ||
The chain of fifths gives you the seven naturals, and their sharps and flats. The sharp or flat of a note is (what is commonly called) a neutral second away - the double-sharp adds up to a minor third away. This has led certain complainers, aiming to notate 17 edo (which is relatively popular), to want an extra | The chain of fifths gives you the seven naturals, and their sharps and flats. The sharp or flat of a note is (what is commonly called) a neutral second away - the double-sharp adds up to a minor third away. This has led certain complainers, aiming to notate 17 edo (which is relatively popular), to want an extra character to raise something a small step of which. The 34 tone equal temperament, however, can be constructed from two equally spaced 17-note scales: a symbol indicating an adjustment of 1/34 up or down also serves the purpose of the previous sentence, by using two of it. This systemology of course emphasizes certain aspects of 34-edo which may not be most efficient expressions of some musical purposes: The reader can easily construct his own notation. One concern is that a system with 15 nominals for example, instead of seven, might be waste - of paper, space, brainmemory etc. if they aren't used consecutively and frequently. The system spelled out here has familiarity as an advantage or disadvantage. Tangentially, while the table uses ^ and v for "up" and "down", Kosmorosky prefers using filled in triangles because that's what I decided on years ago, and he's one of a handful of people worldwide who uses the tuning extensively, as far as I know, but whatever, I can't hit you through a computer if you use alternate symbols! | ||
==<span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Commas</span>== | ==<span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Commas</span>== | ||
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==Listen== | ==Listen== | ||
* [[@http://www.archive.org/details/Ascension_105|Ascension]] | * [[@http://www.archive.org/details/Ascension_105|Ascension]] | ||
* [[@https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXTM0HeuExk|Uncomfortable In Crowds (extended)]] by Robin Perry | * [[@https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXTM0HeuExk|Uncomfortable In Crowds (extended)]] by Robin Perry | ||
==Links== | ==Links== | ||
* [[http://www.microstick.net/34guitararticle.htm|34 Equal Guitar]] by [[xenharmonic/Larry Hanson|Larry Hanson]]</pre></div> | * [[http://www.microstick.net/34guitararticle.htm|34 Equal Guitar]] by [[xenharmonic/Larry Hanson|Larry Hanson]] | ||
* [[https://microstick.net|http://microstick.net/]] websites of Neil Haverstick | |||
* [[https://myspace.com/microstick]]</pre></div> | |||
<h4>Original HTML content:</h4> | <h4>Original HTML content:</h4> | ||
<div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;width:200%;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html"><html><head><title>34edo</title></head><body><!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:0:&lt;h1&gt; --><h1 id="toc0"><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:0 --> </h1> | <div style="width:100%; max-height:400pt; overflow:auto; background-color:#f8f9fa; border: 1px solid #eaecf0; padding:0em"><pre style="margin:0px;border:none;background:none;word-wrap:break-word;width:200%;white-space: pre-wrap ! important" class="old-revision-html"><html><head><title>34edo</title></head><body><!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:0:&lt;h1&gt; --><h1 id="toc0"><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:0 --> </h1> | ||
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<br /> | <br /> | ||
<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:2:&lt;h3&gt; --><h3 id="toc1"><a name="x--Approximations to Just Intonation"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:2 -->Approximations to Just Intonation</h3> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:2:&lt;h3&gt; --><h3 id="toc1"><a name="x--Approximations to Just Intonation"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:2 -->Approximations to Just Intonation</h3> | ||
Like <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/17edo">17edo</a>, 34edo contains good approximations of just intervals involving 13 and 3 -- specifically, 13/8, 13/12, 13/9 and their inversions -- while failing to closely approximate ratios of 7 or 11. 34edo adds ratios of 5 into the mix -- including 5/4, 6/5, 9/5, 15/8, 13/10, 15/13, and their inversions -- as well as 17 -- including 17/16, 18/17, 17/12, 17/10, 17/13, 17/15 and their inversions. Since it distinguishes between 9/8 and 10/9 (exaggerating the difference between them, the syntonic comma of 81/80, from 21.5 cents to 35.3 cents), it is suitable for 5-limit JI. It is not a <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/meantone">meantone </a>system.<br /> | Like <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/17edo">17edo</a>, 34edo contains good approximations of just intervals involving 13 and 3 -- specifically, 13/8, 13/12, 13/9 and their inversions -- while failing to closely approximate ratios of 7 or 11.* 34edo adds ratios of 5 into the mix -- including 5/4, 6/5, 9/5, 15/8, 13/10, 15/13, and their inversions -- as well as 17 -- including 17/16, 18/17, 17/12, 17/10, 17/13, 17/15 and their inversions. Since it distinguishes between 9/8 and 10/9 (exaggerating the difference between them, the &quot;syntonic comma&quot; of 81/80, from 21.5 cents to 35.3 cents), it is suitable for 5-limit JI. It is not a <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/meantone">meantone </a>system. In layman's terms while no number of fifths (frequently ratios of ~3:2) land on major or minor thirds, an even number of major or minor thirds, technically will be the same pitch as something, somewhere upon the cycle of seventeen fifths.<br /> | ||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
<em>Viewed in light of Western diatonic theory, the three extra steps (of 34-et compared to 31-et) in effect widen the intervals between C and D, F and G, and A and B [that is: 6 5 3 6 5 6 3], thus making a distinction between major tones, ratio 9/8 and minor tones, ratio 10/9.</em> (<a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34_equal_temperament" rel="nofollow">Wikipedia</a>)<br /> | <em>Viewed in light of Western diatonic theory, the three extra steps (of 34-et compared to 31-et) in effect widen the intervals between C and D, F and G, and A and B [that is: 6 5 3 6 5 6 3], thus making a distinction between major tones, ratio 9/8 and minor tones, ratio 10/9.</em> (<a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/34_equal_temperament" rel="nofollow">Wikipedia</a>)<br /> | ||
<br /> | |||
*The sharpness of ~13 cents of 11/8 can fit somewhat with the 9/8 and 13/8 which both are about 7 cents sharp. Likewise the 20-cent sharpness or flatness of either approximation to 7/4 isn't impossible. The ability to tolerate these errors may depend on subtle natural changes in mood. <a class="wiki_link" href="/68edo">68edo</a>, double 34, has both these intervals in more perfect form, the 7 especially so.<br /> | |||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:4:&lt;h3&gt; --><h3 id="toc2"><a name="x--34edo and phi"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:4 -->34edo and phi</h3> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:4:&lt;h3&gt; --><h3 id="toc2"><a name="x--34edo and phi"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:4 -->34edo and phi</h3> | ||
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<td><br /> | <td><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>C<br /> | <td>C = B^^ = A##<br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
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<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:10:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc5"><a name="x-Notations"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:10 --><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Notations</span></h2> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:10:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc5"><a name="x-Notations"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:10 --><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Notations</span></h2> | ||
The chain of fifths gives you the seven naturals, and their sharps and flats. The sharp or flat of a note is (what is commonly called) a neutral second away - the double-sharp adds up to a minor third away. This has led certain complainers, aiming to notate 17 edo (which is relatively popular), to want an extra | The chain of fifths gives you the seven naturals, and their sharps and flats. The sharp or flat of a note is (what is commonly called) a neutral second away - the double-sharp adds up to a minor third away. This has led certain complainers, aiming to notate 17 edo (which is relatively popular), to want an extra character to raise something a small step of which. The 34 tone equal temperament, however, can be constructed from two equally spaced 17-note scales: a symbol indicating an adjustment of 1/34 up or down also serves the purpose of the previous sentence, by using two of it. This systemology of course emphasizes certain aspects of 34-edo which may not be most efficient expressions of some musical purposes: The reader can easily construct his own notation. One concern is that a system with 15 nominals for example, instead of seven, might be waste - of paper, space, brainmemory etc. if they aren't used consecutively and frequently. The system spelled out here has familiarity as an advantage or disadvantage. Tangentially, while the table uses ^ and v for &quot;up&quot; and &quot;down&quot;, Kosmorosky prefers using filled in triangles because that's what I decided on years ago, and he's one of a handful of people worldwide who uses the tuning extensively, as far as I know, but whatever, I can't hit you through a computer if you use alternate symbols!<br /> | ||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:12:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc6"><a name="x-Commas"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:12 --><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Commas</span></h2> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:12:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc6"><a name="x-Commas"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:12 --><span style="background-color: #ffffff;">Commas</span></h2> | ||
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<br /> | <br /> | ||
<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:14:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc7"><a name="x-Listen"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:14 -->Listen</h2> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:14:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc7"><a name="x-Listen"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:14 -->Listen</h2> | ||
<ul><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://www.archive.org/details/Ascension_105" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Ascension</a> | <ul><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://www.archive.org/details/Ascension_105" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Ascension</a></li><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXTM0HeuExk" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Uncomfortable In Crowds (extended)</a> by Robin Perry</li></ul><!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:16:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc8"><a name="x-Links"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:16 -->Links</h2> | ||
<ul><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://www.microstick.net/34guitararticle.htm" rel="nofollow">34 Equal Guitar</a> by <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/Larry%20Hanson">Larry Hanson</a></li></ul></body></html></pre></div> | <ul><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://www.microstick.net/34guitararticle.htm" rel="nofollow">34 Equal Guitar</a> by <a class="wiki_link" href="http://xenharmonic.wikispaces.com/Larry%20Hanson">Larry Hanson</a></li><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://microstick.net" rel="nofollow">http://microstick.net/</a> websites of Neil Haverstick</li><li><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="https://myspace.com/microstick" rel="nofollow">https://myspace.com/microstick</a></li></ul></body></html></pre></div> |