Kite's thoughts on pergens: Difference between revisions
Wikispaces>TallKite **Imported revision 629328923 - Original comment: ** |
Wikispaces>TallKite **Imported revision 629465635 - Original comment: ** |
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<h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | <h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | ||
This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | ||
: This revision was by author [[User:TallKite|TallKite]] and made on <tt>2018-05- | : This revision was by author [[User:TallKite|TallKite]] and made on <tt>2018-05-06 23:02:07 UTC</tt>.<br> | ||
: The original revision id was <tt> | : The original revision id was <tt>629465635</tt>.<br> | ||
: The revision comment was: <tt></tt><br> | : The revision comment was: <tt></tt><br> | ||
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There's a lot of options in rank-3 double-pair notation for what ratio each accidental pair represents. For example, deep reddish is half-8ve, with a d2 comma, like srutal. Using the same notation as srutal, but with ^1 = 81/80, we have P = \A4 = /d5 and E = ``//``d2. The ratio for /1 is (-10,6,-1,1), a descending interval. 7/4 = 5/4 + 7/5 = vM3 + /d5 = v/m7, and the 4:5:6:7 chord is spelled awkwardly as C Ev G Bbv/. However, double-pair notation for 7-limit rank-3 temperaments can be standardized so that ^1 is always 81/80 and /1 is always 64/63. This ensures the 4:5:6:7 chord is always spelled C Ev G Bb\. | There's a lot of options in rank-3 double-pair notation for what ratio each accidental pair represents. For example, deep reddish is half-8ve, with a d2 comma, like srutal. Using the same notation as srutal, but with ^1 = 81/80, we have P = \A4 = /d5 and E = ``//``d2. The ratio for /1 is (-10,6,-1,1), a descending interval. 7/4 = 5/4 + 7/5 = vM3 + /d5 = v/m7, and the 4:5:6:7 chord is spelled awkwardly as C Ev G Bbv/. However, double-pair notation for 7-limit rank-3 temperaments can be standardized so that ^1 is always 81/80 and /1 is always 64/63. This ensures the 4:5:6:7 chord is always spelled C Ev G Bb\. | ||
With this standardization, the enharmonic can be derived directly from the comma. The vanishing comma is written as some 3-limit comma plus some number of mapping commas. For example, 50/49 = (81/80)<span style="vertical-align: super;">-2</span> · (64/63)<span style="vertical-align: super;">2</span> · (19, | With this standardization, the enharmonic can be derived directly from the comma. The vanishing comma is written as some 3-limit comma plus some number of mapping commas. For example, 50/49 = (81/80)<span style="vertical-align: super;">-2</span> · (64/63)<span style="vertical-align: super;">2</span> · (-19,12). This can be rewritten as vv1 + ``//``1 - d2 = vv``//``-d2 = -^^\\d2. The comma is negative (i.e.descending), but the enharmonic never is, therefore E = ^^\\d2. The period is found by adding/subtracting E from the 8ve and dividing by two, thus P = v/A4 = ^\d5. Both E and P become more complex, but the ratio for /1 becomes simpler. | ||
This 3-limit comma defines the tipping point. At the tipping point, the 3-limit comma vanishes too. In a rank-2 temperament, the mapping comma must also vanish, because some number of them plus the 3-limit comma must add up to the original comma, which vanishes. However, a rank-3 temperament has two mapping commas, and neither is forced to vanish if the 3-limit comma vanishes. A rank-3 double-pair notation's tipping point is where both mapping commas are tempered out. For deep reddish, this happens when the tuning is exactly 12edo. This tuning is much farther from just than need be, well outside the sweet spot. Therefore deep reddish doesn't tip. Single-pair rank-3 notation has no enharmonic, and thus no tipping point. Double-pair rank-3 notation has 1 enharmonic, but two mapping commas. Rank-3 notations rarely tip. | This 3-limit comma defines the tipping point. At the tipping point, the 3-limit comma vanishes too. In a rank-2 temperament, the mapping comma must also vanish, because some number of them plus the 3-limit comma must add up to the original comma, which vanishes. However, a rank-3 temperament has two mapping commas, and neither is forced to vanish if the 3-limit comma vanishes. A rank-3 double-pair notation's tipping point is where both mapping commas are tempered out. For deep reddish, this happens when the tuning is exactly 12edo. This tuning is much farther from just than need be, well outside the sweet spot. Therefore deep reddish doesn't tip. Single-pair rank-3 notation has no enharmonic, and thus no tipping point. Double-pair rank-3 notation has 1 enharmonic, but two mapping commas. Rank-3 notations rarely tip. | ||
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There's a lot of options in rank-3 double-pair notation for what ratio each accidental pair represents. For example, deep reddish is half-8ve, with a d2 comma, like srutal. Using the same notation as srutal, but with ^1 = 81/80, we have P = \A4 = /d5 and E = <!-- ws:start:WikiTextRawRule:060:``//`` -->//<!-- ws:end:WikiTextRawRule:060 -->d2. The ratio for /1 is (-10,6,-1,1), a descending interval. 7/4 = 5/4 + 7/5 = vM3 + /d5 = v/m7, and the 4:5:6:7 chord is spelled awkwardly as C Ev G Bbv/. However, double-pair notation for 7-limit rank-3 temperaments can be standardized so that ^1 is always 81/80 and /1 is always 64/63. This ensures the 4:5:6:7 chord is always spelled C Ev G Bb\.<br /> | There's a lot of options in rank-3 double-pair notation for what ratio each accidental pair represents. For example, deep reddish is half-8ve, with a d2 comma, like srutal. Using the same notation as srutal, but with ^1 = 81/80, we have P = \A4 = /d5 and E = <!-- ws:start:WikiTextRawRule:060:``//`` -->//<!-- ws:end:WikiTextRawRule:060 -->d2. The ratio for /1 is (-10,6,-1,1), a descending interval. 7/4 = 5/4 + 7/5 = vM3 + /d5 = v/m7, and the 4:5:6:7 chord is spelled awkwardly as C Ev G Bbv/. However, double-pair notation for 7-limit rank-3 temperaments can be standardized so that ^1 is always 81/80 and /1 is always 64/63. This ensures the 4:5:6:7 chord is always spelled C Ev G Bb\.<br /> | ||
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With this standardization, the enharmonic can be derived directly from the comma. The vanishing comma is written as some 3-limit comma plus some number of mapping commas. For example, 50/49 = (81/80)<span style="vertical-align: super;">-2</span> · (64/63)<span style="vertical-align: super;">2</span> · (19, | With this standardization, the enharmonic can be derived directly from the comma. The vanishing comma is written as some 3-limit comma plus some number of mapping commas. For example, 50/49 = (81/80)<span style="vertical-align: super;">-2</span> · (64/63)<span style="vertical-align: super;">2</span> · (-19,12). This can be rewritten as vv1 + <!-- ws:start:WikiTextRawRule:061:``//`` -->//<!-- ws:end:WikiTextRawRule:061 -->1 - d2 = vv<!-- ws:start:WikiTextRawRule:062:``//`` -->//<!-- ws:end:WikiTextRawRule:062 -->-d2 = -^^\\d2. The comma is negative (i.e.descending), but the enharmonic never is, therefore E = ^^\\d2. The period is found by adding/subtracting E from the 8ve and dividing by two, thus P = v/A4 = ^\d5. Both E and P become more complex, but the ratio for /1 becomes simpler.<br /> | ||
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This 3-limit comma defines the tipping point. At the tipping point, the 3-limit comma vanishes too. In a rank-2 temperament, the mapping comma must also vanish, because some number of them plus the 3-limit comma must add up to the original comma, which vanishes. However, a rank-3 temperament has two mapping commas, and neither is forced to vanish if the 3-limit comma vanishes. A rank-3 double-pair notation's tipping point is where both mapping commas are tempered out. For deep reddish, this happens when the tuning is exactly 12edo. This tuning is much farther from just than need be, well outside the sweet spot. Therefore deep reddish doesn't tip. Single-pair rank-3 notation has no enharmonic, and thus no tipping point. Double-pair rank-3 notation has 1 enharmonic, but two mapping commas. Rank-3 notations rarely tip.<br /> | This 3-limit comma defines the tipping point. At the tipping point, the 3-limit comma vanishes too. In a rank-2 temperament, the mapping comma must also vanish, because some number of them plus the 3-limit comma must add up to the original comma, which vanishes. However, a rank-3 temperament has two mapping commas, and neither is forced to vanish if the 3-limit comma vanishes. A rank-3 double-pair notation's tipping point is where both mapping commas are tempered out. For deep reddish, this happens when the tuning is exactly 12edo. This tuning is much farther from just than need be, well outside the sweet spot. Therefore deep reddish doesn't tip. Single-pair rank-3 notation has no enharmonic, and thus no tipping point. Double-pair rank-3 notation has 1 enharmonic, but two mapping commas. Rank-3 notations rarely tip.<br /> | ||
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Alt-pergenLister lists out thousands of rank-2 pergens, and suggests periods, generators and enharmonics for each one. Alternate enharmonics are not listed, but single-pair notation for false-double pergens is. It can also list only those pergens supported by a specific edo or edo pair. Written in Jesusonic, runs inside Reaper.<br /> | Alt-pergenLister lists out thousands of rank-2 pergens, and suggests periods, generators and enharmonics for each one. Alternate enharmonics are not listed, but single-pair notation for false-double pergens is. It can also list only those pergens supported by a specific edo or edo pair. Written in Jesusonic, runs inside Reaper.<br /> | ||
<!-- ws:start:WikiTextUrlRule: | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextUrlRule:8487:http://www.tallkite.com/misc_files/alt-pergenLister.zip --><a class="wiki_link_ext" href="http://www.tallkite.com/misc_files/alt-pergenLister.zip" rel="nofollow">http://www.tallkite.com/misc_files/alt-pergenLister.zip</a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextUrlRule:8487 --><br /> | ||
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The first section (PERGEN and Per/Gen cents) describes each pergen without regard to notational issues. The period and generator's cents are given, assuming a 5th of 700¢ + c. The generator is reduced, e.g. (P8/2, P5) has a generator of 100¢ + c, not 700¢ + c. The next two sections show a possible notation for P and G. The last section shows the unreduced pergen, and for false doubles, a possible single-pair notation. Horizontal lines group the pergens into blocks (half-splits, third-splits, etc). Red indicates problems. Generators of 50¢ or less are in red. Enharmonics of a 3rd or more are in red.<br /> | The first section (PERGEN and Per/Gen cents) describes each pergen without regard to notational issues. The period and generator's cents are given, assuming a 5th of 700¢ + c. The generator is reduced, e.g. (P8/2, P5) has a generator of 100¢ + c, not 700¢ + c. The next two sections show a possible notation for P and G. The last section shows the unreduced pergen, and for false doubles, a possible single-pair notation. Horizontal lines group the pergens into blocks (half-splits, third-splits, etc). Red indicates problems. Generators of 50¢ or less are in red. Enharmonics of a 3rd or more are in red.<br /> | ||