5-limit: Difference between revisions
Wikispaces>PiotrGrochowski **Imported revision 589203844 - Original comment: ** |
Wikispaces>PiotrGrochowski **Imported revision 591567350 - Original comment: expanded table** |
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<h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | <h2>IMPORTED REVISION FROM WIKISPACES</h2> | ||
This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | This is an imported revision from Wikispaces. The revision metadata is included below for reference:<br> | ||
: This revision was by author [[User:PiotrGrochowski|PiotrGrochowski]] and made on <tt>2016- | : This revision was by author [[User:PiotrGrochowski|PiotrGrochowski]] and made on <tt>2016-09-10 10:51:54 UTC</tt>.<br> | ||
: The original revision id was <tt> | : The original revision id was <tt>591567350</tt>.<br> | ||
: The revision comment was: <tt></tt><br> | : The revision comment was: <tt>expanded table</tt><br> | ||
The revision contents are below, presented both in the original Wikispaces Wikitext format, and in HTML exactly as Wikispaces rendered it.<br> | The revision contents are below, presented both in the original Wikispaces Wikitext format, and in HTML exactly as Wikispaces rendered it.<br> | ||
<h4>Original Wikitext content:</h4> | <h4>Original Wikitext content:</h4> | ||
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==Syntonic Comma Pairs== | ==Syntonic Comma Pairs== | ||
A significant interval in 5-limit JI is [[81_80|81/80]], the syntonic comma or Didymus' comma, which measures about 21.5¢. Although it rarely appears as an interval in a scale, it represents the difference between many 5-limit intervals and a nearby [[3-limit]] (Pythagorean) interval. 81/80 is tempered out in [[12edo]], [[meantone]], and many other related systems, meaning that those 5- and 3-limit distinctions are obliterated and one interval stands in for each. Living in a largely [[12edo]] musical culture from birth, we are not accustomed to distinguishing two different major thirds, two different minor seconds, etc. Below is a list of some common intervals involving 3 and 5 which are distinguished by 81/80. | A significant interval in 5-limit JI is [[81_80|81/80]], the syntonic comma or Didymus' comma, which measures about 21.5¢. Although it rarely appears as an interval in a scale, it represents the difference between many 5-limit intervals and a nearby [[3-limit]] (Pythagorean) interval. 81/80 is tempered out in [[12edo]], [[meantone]], and many other related systems, meaning that those 5- and 3-limit distinctions are obliterated and one interval stands in for each. Living in a largely [[12edo]] musical culture from birth, we are not accustomed to distinguishing two different major thirds, two different minor seconds, etc. Below is a list of some common intervals involving 3 and 5 which are distinguished by 81/80. The next column modifies intervals by another 81/80, for a total of 6561/6400 (43 cents). **Bold** inter are | ||
||||~ 3-limit interval ||~ interval category ||||~ 5-limit interval || | ||||~ 3-limit interval ||||~ interval category ||||~ |5-limit interval (81/80) ||||~ |Another 5-limit (6561/6400) || | ||
||~ ratio ||~ cents value ||~ ||~ ratio ||~ cents value || | ||~ ratio ||~ cents value ||~ ||~ ||~ ratio ||~ cents value ||~ ratio ||~ cents value || | ||
|| [[256_243|256/243]] || 90.225 || minor 2nd || [[16_15|16/15]] || 111.731 || | || [[1_1|1/1]] || 0.000 || unison || C || [[81_80|81/80]] || 21.506 || [[6561_6400|6561/6400]] || 43.013 || | ||
|| [[9_8|9/8]] || 203.910 || major 2nd || [[10_9|10/9]] || 182.404 || | || [[2187_2048|2187/2048]] || 113.685 || aug. unison || C# || [[135_128|135/128]] || 92.179 || [[25_24|25/24]] || 70.672 || | ||
|| [[32_27|32/27]] || 294.135 || minor 3rd || [[6_5|6/5]] || 315.641 || | || [[256_243|256/243]] || 90.225 || minor 2nd || Db || [[16_15|16/15]] || 111.731 || [[27_25|27/25]] || 133.238 || | ||
|| [[81_64|81/64]] || 407.820 || major 3rd || [[5_4|5/4]] || 386.314 || | || [[9_8|9/8]] || 203.910 || major 2nd || D || [[10_9|10/9]] || 182.404 || [[800_729|800/729]] || 160.897 || | ||
|| [[4_3|4/3]] || 498.045 || fourth || [[27_20|27/20]] || 519.551 || | || [[19683_16384|19683/16384]] || 317.595 || aug. 2nd || D# || [[1215_1024|1215/1024]] || 296.089 || [[75_64|75/64]] || 274.582 || | ||
|| [[3_2|3/2]] || 701.955 || fifth || [[40_27|40/27]] || 680.449 || | || [[32_27|32/27]] || 294.135 || minor 3rd || Eb || [[6_5|6/5]] || 315.641 || [[243_200|243/200]] || 337.148 || | ||
|| [[128_81|128/81]] || 792. | || [[81_64|81/64]] || 407.820 || major 3rd || E || [[5_4|5/4]] || 386.314 || [[100_81|100/81]] || 364.807 || | ||
|| [[27_16|27/16]] || 905.865 || major 6th || [[5_3|5/3]] || 884.359 || | || [[8192_6561|8192/6561]] || 384.360 || dim. fourth || Fb || [[512_405|512/405]] || 405.866 || [[32_25|32/25]] || 427.373 || | ||
|| [[16_9|16/9]] || 996.090 || minor 7th || [[9_5|9/5]] || 1017.596 || | || [[4_3|4/3]] || 498.045 || fourth || F || [[27_20|27/20]] || 519.551 || [[2187_1600|2187/1600]] || 541.058 || | ||
|| [[243_128|243/128]] || 1109.775 || major 7th || [[15_8|15/8]] || 1088.269 || | || [[729_512|729/512]] || 611.730 || aug. fourth || F# || [[45_32|45/32]] || 590.224 || [[25_18|25/18]] || 568.717 || | ||
|| [[1024_729|1024/729]] || 588.270 || dim. fifth || Gb || [[64_45|64/45]] || 609.776 || [[36_25|36/25]] || 631.283 || | |||
|| [[3_2|3/2]] || 701.955 || fifth || G || [[40_27|40/27]] || 680.449 || [[3200_2187|3200/2187]] || 658.942 || | |||
|| [[6561_4096|6561/4096]] || 815.640 || aug. fifth || G# || [[405_256|405/256]] || 794.134 || [[25_16|25/16]] || 772.627 || | |||
|| [[128_81|128/81]] || 792.180 || minor 6th || Ab || [[8_5|8/5]] || 813.686 || [[81_50|81/50]] || 835.193 || | |||
|| [[27_16|27/16]] || 905.865 || major 6th || A || [[5_3|5/3]] || 884.359 || [[400_243|400/243]] || 862.852 || | |||
|| [[32768_19683|32768/19683]] || 882.405 || dim. 7th || Bbb || [[2048_1215|2048/1215]] || 903.911 || [[128_75|128/75]] || 925.418 || | |||
|| [[16_9|16/9]] || 996.090 || minor 7th || Bb || [[9_5|9/5]] || 1017.596 || [[729_400|729/400]] || 1039.103 || | |||
|| [[243_128|243/128]] || 1109.775 || major 7th || B || [[15_8|15/8]] || 1088.269 || [[50_27|50/27]] || 1066.762 || | |||
|| [[4096_2187|4096/2187]] || 1086.315 || dim. octave || Cb || [[256_135|256/135]] || 1107.821 || [[48_25|48/25]] || 1129.328 || | |||
|| [[2_1|2/1]] || 1200.000 || octave || C || [[160_81|160/81]] || 1178.494 || [[12800_6561|12800/6561]] || 1156.987 || | |||
It is important to note that 5-limit music does not mean favoring intervals of 5 over intervals of 3. It means allowing for //both// 3's and 5's in generating harmonic material, and so it is an interplay between both. The 5-limit //includes// the 3-limit -- a work in 5-limit JI will utilize intervals from both sides of the chart above. | It is important to note that 5-limit music does not mean favoring intervals of 5 over intervals of 3. It means allowing for //both// 3's and 5's in generating harmonic material, and so it is an interplay between both. The 5-limit //includes// the 3-limit -- a work in 5-limit JI will utilize intervals from both sides of the chart above. | ||
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<!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:0:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc0"><a name="x-Syntonic Comma Pairs"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:0 -->Syntonic Comma Pairs</h2> | <!-- ws:start:WikiTextHeadingRule:0:&lt;h2&gt; --><h2 id="toc0"><a name="x-Syntonic Comma Pairs"></a><!-- ws:end:WikiTextHeadingRule:0 -->Syntonic Comma Pairs</h2> | ||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
A significant interval in 5-limit JI is <a class="wiki_link" href="/81_80">81/80</a>, the syntonic comma or Didymus' comma, which measures about 21.5¢. Although it rarely appears as an interval in a scale, it represents the difference between many 5-limit intervals and a nearby <a class="wiki_link" href="/3-limit">3-limit</a> (Pythagorean) interval. 81/80 is tempered out in <a class="wiki_link" href="/12edo">12edo</a>, <a class="wiki_link" href="/meantone">meantone</a>, and many other related systems, meaning that those 5- and 3-limit distinctions are obliterated and one interval stands in for each. Living in a largely <a class="wiki_link" href="/12edo">12edo</a> musical culture from birth, we are not accustomed to distinguishing two different major thirds, two different minor seconds, etc. Below is a list of some common intervals involving 3 and 5 which are distinguished by 81/80.<br /> | A significant interval in 5-limit JI is <a class="wiki_link" href="/81_80">81/80</a>, the syntonic comma or Didymus' comma, which measures about 21.5¢. Although it rarely appears as an interval in a scale, it represents the difference between many 5-limit intervals and a nearby <a class="wiki_link" href="/3-limit">3-limit</a> (Pythagorean) interval. 81/80 is tempered out in <a class="wiki_link" href="/12edo">12edo</a>, <a class="wiki_link" href="/meantone">meantone</a>, and many other related systems, meaning that those 5- and 3-limit distinctions are obliterated and one interval stands in for each. Living in a largely <a class="wiki_link" href="/12edo">12edo</a> musical culture from birth, we are not accustomed to distinguishing two different major thirds, two different minor seconds, etc. Below is a list of some common intervals involving 3 and 5 which are distinguished by 81/80. The next column modifies intervals by another 81/80, for a total of 6561/6400 (43 cents). <strong>Bold</strong> inter are<br /> | ||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
| Line 58: | Line 68: | ||
<th colspan="2">3-limit interval<br /> | <th colspan="2">3-limit interval<br /> | ||
</th> | </th> | ||
<th>interval category<br /> | <th colspan="2">interval category<br /> | ||
</th> | </th> | ||
<th colspan="2">5-limit interval<br /> | <th colspan="2">|5-limit interval (81/80)<br /> | ||
</th> | |||
<th colspan="2">|Another 5-limit (6561/6400)<br /> | |||
</th> | </th> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 67: | Line 79: | ||
</th> | </th> | ||
<th>cents value<br /> | <th>cents value<br /> | ||
</th> | |||
<th><br /> | |||
</th> | </th> | ||
<th><br /> | <th><br /> | ||
| Line 74: | Line 88: | ||
<th>cents value<br /> | <th>cents value<br /> | ||
</th> | </th> | ||
<th>ratio<br /> | |||
</th> | |||
<th>cents value<br /> | |||
</th> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/1_1">1/1</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>0.000<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>unison<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>C<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/81_80">81/80</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>21.506<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/6561_6400">6561/6400</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>43.013<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/2187_2048">2187/2048</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>113.685<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>aug. unison<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>C#<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/135_128">135/128</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>92.179<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/25_24">25/24</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>70.672<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
<tr> | <tr> | ||
| Line 81: | Line 135: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>minor 2nd<br /> | <td>minor 2nd<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>Db<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/16_15">16/15</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/16_15">16/15</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>111.731<br /> | <td>111.731<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/27_25">27/25</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>133.238<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 93: | Line 153: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>major 2nd<br /> | <td>major 2nd<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>D<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/10_9">10/9</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/10_9">10/9</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>182.404<br /> | <td>182.404<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/800_729">800/729</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>160.897<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/19683_16384">19683/16384</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>317.595<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>aug. 2nd<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>D#<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/1215_1024">1215/1024</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>296.089<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/75_64">75/64</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>274.582<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 105: | Line 189: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>minor 3rd<br /> | <td>minor 3rd<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>Eb<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/6_5">6/5</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/6_5">6/5</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>315.641<br /> | <td>315.641<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/243_200">243/200</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>337.148<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 117: | Line 207: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>major 3rd<br /> | <td>major 3rd<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>E<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/5_4">5/4</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/5_4">5/4</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>386.314<br /> | <td>386.314<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/100_81">100/81</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>364.807<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/8192_6561">8192/6561</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>384.360<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>dim. fourth<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>Fb<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/512_405">512/405</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>405.866<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/32_25">32/25</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>427.373<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 129: | Line 243: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>fourth<br /> | <td>fourth<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>F<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/27_20">27/20</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/27_20">27/20</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>519.551<br /> | <td>519.551<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/2187_1600">2187/1600</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>541.058<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/729_512">729/512</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>611.730<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>aug. fourth<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>F#<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/45_32">45/32</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>590.224<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/25_18">25/18</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>568.717<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/1024_729">1024/729</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>588.270<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>dim. fifth<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>Gb<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/64_45">64/45</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>609.776<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/36_25">36/25</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>631.283<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 141: | Line 297: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>fifth<br /> | <td>fifth<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>G<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/40_27">40/27</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/40_27">40/27</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>680.449<br /> | <td>680.449<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/3200_2187">3200/2187</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>658.942<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/6561_4096">6561/4096</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>815.640<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>aug. fifth<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>G#<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/405_256">405/256</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>794.134<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/25_16">25/16</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>772.627<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 150: | Line 330: | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/128_81">128/81</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/128_81">128/81</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>792. | <td>792.180<br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>minor 6th<br /> | <td>minor 6th<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>Ab<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/8_5">8/5</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/8_5">8/5</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>813.686<br /> | <td>813.686<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/81_50">81/50</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>835.193<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 165: | Line 351: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>major 6th<br /> | <td>major 6th<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>A<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/5_3">5/3</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/5_3">5/3</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>884.359<br /> | <td>884.359<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/400_243">400/243</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>862.852<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/32768_19683">32768/19683</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>882.405<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>dim. 7th<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>Bbb<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/2048_1215">2048/1215</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>903.911<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/128_75">128/75</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>925.418<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 177: | Line 387: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>minor 7th<br /> | <td>minor 7th<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>Bb<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/9_5">9/5</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/9_5">9/5</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>1017.596<br /> | <td>1017.596<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/729_400">729/400</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1039.103<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||
| Line 189: | Line 405: | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>major 7th<br /> | <td>major 7th<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td>B<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/15_8">15/8</a><br /> | <td><a class="wiki_link" href="/15_8">15/8</a><br /> | ||
</td> | </td> | ||
<td>1088.269<br /> | <td>1088.269<br /> | ||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/50_27">50/27</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1066.762<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/4096_2187">4096/2187</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1086.315<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>dim. octave<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>Cb<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/256_135">256/135</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1107.821<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/48_25">48/25</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1129.328<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
</tr> | |||
<tr> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/2_1">2/1</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1200.000<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>octave<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>C<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/160_81">160/81</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1178.494<br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td><a class="wiki_link" href="/12800_6561">12800/6561</a><br /> | |||
</td> | |||
<td>1156.987<br /> | |||
</td> | </td> | ||
</tr> | </tr> | ||