User talk:Rperlner: Difference between revisions

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:::::::::::: Yes, that is exactly the chord progression I'm referring to. If Bach used it, then that means the so-called "purists" were wrong. I guess one reason that the "purists" take the stance they do is because the IIm-VM-IM is a stronger motion and is thus better suited to close out the main body of a song in a number of ways. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 23:56, 5 January 2021 (UTC)

::::::::::::: To be fair, the wiki example using Bach is a little wonky (over a tonic pedal and could be ~~ii43~~ instead of IV). Here's a much clearer Bach example that ends with IV7 V7 I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt2K1KYkblo&feature=emb_logo . Not that you need Bach. Any Western art music from about 1650-1900 counts. --[[User:Rperlner|Rperlner]] ([[User talk:Rperlner|talk]]) 01:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

::::::::::::: To be fair, the wiki example using Bach is a little wonky (over a tonic pedal and could be ii42 instead of IV). Here's a much clearer Bach example that ends with IV7 V7 I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt2K1KYkblo&feature=emb_logo . Not that you need Bach. Any Western art music from about 1650-1900 counts. --[[User:Rperlner|Rperlner]] ([[User talk:Rperlner|talk]]) 01:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

:::::::::::::: Looks like the so-called "purists" in the Music Theory department really were wrong about the IVM-VM-IM after all. Still, the usage of the IIm-VM-IM cadence does have serious merits- especially in an Ionian circle progression containing the final cadence. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 01:15, 6 January 2021 (UTC)

:: I know this may sound hard to believe, but in all my experimenting with different intervals, I've found that the wrong kind of interval involving small-number-ratios between the wrong two notes actually works against the formation of a sense of tonality. Conversely, a more tense-sounding interval in the right location- yes, even if the interval in question happens to be [[40/27]]- can actually strengthen your sense of tonality. Yes, intervals with small-number-ratios are vital to establishing tonality, but because of their power, they have to be well-placed within the tonal system, or otherwise the sense of tonality shifts when you don't want it to. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 04:50, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

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 :::::::::::: Yes, that is exactly the chord progression I'm referring to.  If Bach used it, then that means the so-called "purists" were wrong.  I guess one reason that the "purists" take the stance they do is because the IIm-VM-IM is a stronger motion and is thus better suited to close out the main body of a song in a number of ways. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 23:56, 5 January 2021 (UTC)
-::::::::::::: To be fair, the wiki example using Bach is a little wonky (over a tonic pedal and could be ii43 instead of IV). Here's a much clearer Bach example that ends with IV7 V7 I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt2K1KYkblo&feature=emb_logo . Not that you need Bach. Any Western art music from about 1650-1900 counts. --[[User:Rperlner|Rperlner]] ([[User talk:Rperlner|talk]]) 01:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
+::::::::::::: To be fair, the wiki example using Bach is a little wonky (over a tonic pedal and could be ii42 instead of IV). Here's a much clearer Bach example that ends with IV7 V7 I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gt2K1KYkblo&feature=emb_logo . Not that you need Bach. Any Western art music from about 1650-1900 counts. --[[User:Rperlner|Rperlner]] ([[User talk:Rperlner|talk]]) 01:05, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 :::::::::::::: Looks like the so-called "purists" in the Music Theory department really were wrong about the IVM-VM-IM after all.  Still, the usage of the IIm-VM-IM cadence does have serious merits- especially in an Ionian circle progression containing the final cadence. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 01:15, 6 January 2021 (UTC)
 :: I know this may sound hard to believe, but in all my experimenting with different intervals, I've found that the wrong kind of interval involving small-number-ratios between the wrong two notes actually works against the formation of a sense of tonality.  Conversely, a more tense-sounding interval in the right location- yes, even if the interval in question happens to be [[40/27]]- can actually strengthen your sense of tonality.  Yes, intervals with small-number-ratios are vital to establishing tonality, but because of their power, they have to be well-placed within the tonal system, or otherwise the sense of tonality shifts when you don't want it to. --[[User:Aura|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura|talk]]) 04:50, 13 December 2020 (UTC)