Talk:Temperament naming - Revision history

Godtone: reply & concur

2024-04-30T23:05:56Z

reply & concur

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	: Any name that was just added by one person without ever getting some kind of consensus should be considered a placeholder -[[User:Sintel\|Sintel]] ([[User talk:Sintel\|talk]]) 17:10, 29 April 2024 (UTC)		: Any name that was just added by one person without ever getting some kind of consensus should be considered a placeholder -[[User:Sintel\|Sintel]] ([[User talk:Sintel\|talk]]) 17:10, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

			:: I concur with FloraC's proposal, but I'd like to add if a comma/temperament was named by a single person and there is no strong reasons for a rename and at least one other person likes it (unless that person co-named the comma) it really doesn't seem worth the effort to rename it unless it's a particularly important comma/temperament. --[[User:Godtone\|Godtone]] ([[User talk:Godtone\|talk]]) 23:05, 30 April 2024 (UTC)

Sintel at 17:10, 29 April 2024

2024-04-29T17:10:07Z

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	== Proposal to reserve the possibility to write over names based on asteroids, highways/buses, etc. ==		== Proposal to reserve the possibility to write over names based on asteroids, highways/buses, etc. ==
	One or two were fine but we have more than a dozen now. These are starting to look like systematic placeholder names. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 10:00, 29 April 2024 (UTC)		One or two were fine but we have more than a dozen now. These are starting to look like systematic placeholder names. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 10:00, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

			: Any name that was just added by one person without ever getting some kind of consensus should be considered a placeholder -[[User:Sintel\|Sintel]] ([[User talk:Sintel\|talk]]) 17:10, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

FloraC at 10:00, 29 April 2024

2024-04-29T10:00:11Z

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	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

			== Proposal to reserve the possibility to write over names based on asteroids, highways/buses, etc. ==
			One or two were fine but we have more than a dozen now. These are starting to look like systematic placeholder names. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 10:00, 29 April 2024 (UTC)

Fredg999: Fredg999 moved page Talk:Temperament names to Talk:Temperament naming: This page should (and hopefully will) be more about the naming process than the names themselves, which should go on each temperament's page (or just before temperament data if no page exists) instead.

2023-08-19T20:05:20Z

Fredg999 moved page Talk:Temperament names to Talk:Temperament naming: This page should (and hopefully will) be more about the naming process than the names themselves, which should go on each temperament's page (or just before temperament data if no page exists) instead.

← Older revision	Revision as of 20:05, 19 August 2023
(No difference)

FloraC: re

2023-06-30T02:08:01Z

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	:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.		:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.
	:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)		:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

			::: Alright. By that definition ''sensi'' is probably just a contraction. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 02:08, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Cmloegcmluin: /* Origin of "sensi" */

2023-06-30T01:34:13Z

Origin of "sensi"

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	: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)		: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

			:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.
			:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

FloraC: /* Origin of "sensi" */ re

2023-06-30T00:55:06Z

Origin of "sensi": re

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	--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)		--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

			: I'm afraid I'm not enlightened on the exact difference between play on words and contraction. To me contraction is a specific type of play on words.

			: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Cmloegcmluin at 22:18, 29 June 2023

2023-06-29T22:18:04Z

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	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

			I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Cmloegcmluin: /* Origin of "sensi" */

2023-06-29T18:12:25Z

Origin of "sensi"

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	--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)		--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

			I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Cmloegcmluin: /* Origin of "sensi" */ new section

2023-06-27T20:54:20Z

Origin of "sensi": new section

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	: He is real. Please see the first bullet of my reply to Xenwolf here: https://en.xen.wiki/w/Talk:Marvel_temperaments#Relation_between_.22Negripent.22_and_Negri		: He is real. Please see the first bullet of my reply to Xenwolf here: https://en.xen.wiki/w/Talk:Marvel_temperaments#Relation_between_.22Negripent.22_and_Negri
	: --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 17:30, 5 June 2023 (UTC)		: --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 17:30, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

			== Origin of "sensi" ==

			I set out to add notes about this whole negripent, negrispet, sensipent, sensisept, dimipent, and dimisept issue (see discussion here: [[Talk:Marvel_temperaments#Relation_between_.22Negripent.22_and_Negri]]), but quickly stumbled across a related problem, which I'll bring up here.

			The [[Sensipent]] page currently states, "The name 'sensi' is a play on the words 'semi-' and 'sixth.'" But this is not quite compatible with the statement on the [[Temperament names]] page: "Originally semisixths ... contracted to sensi." My concern is that contracting is not a play on words, but rather a form of abbreviation. We should be consistent with this description across these two pages. However, I'm not sure which one of these two things is true, because I have searched the Yahoo Groups! archives, and I find no evidence one way or the other.

			The link in the footnote that is currently provided here (to https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning/topicId_97722.html#97733) positions itself as if it provides evidence toward the contraction, however, it does not. It only provides evidence for part of the sentence the footnote is attached to, and so I suggest that the link to the footnote should be placed at the end of that part of the sentence, not at the end of the whole sentence. Specifically, it only provides evidence for the part that reads "it was decided that 'bi' or 'semi' should be half for periods and 'hemi' should be half for generators", and it does not provide evidence for the remaining part of the sentence, where it says "[semisixths] was contracted to sensi".

			To me, it is not clear that semisixths was contracted to sensi, nor that this hemi/semi issue is the reason why.

			I note that Gene had been using sensi alongside semisixths for many years before this:
			# 7/5/2004 "sensi/semisixths" https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_10734.html#10734
			# 8/2/2004 "sensi (semisixths)" https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_10866#11194
			# 8/18/2004 (here he gives "semisixths" as the name for a 5-limit temperament, and "sensi" for a 7-limit extension as well as an 11-limit extension, and "semsi" for a different 11-limit extension; this is to this day documented on Tonalsoft here: http://tonalsoft.com/enc/s/semisixths.aspx) https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_10458#11352
			# 9/13/2004 (refers to sensi without reference to semisixths) https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_11511#11513
			# 7/4/2005 (gives sensi as the 7-limit extension) https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_12362#12362
			# 7/4/2005 "sensi (semisixths)" https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning/topicId_59247.html#59255
			# 10/6/2005 "'sensi' (semisixths)" https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning/topicId_60752.html#61222

			So I think the relationship between these names may be a bit more complicated than we previously thought. And the true origin of "sensi" might be lost to time, though there does seem to be something going on in bullet 3 above, w/r/t the existence of both "semsi" and "sensi". The only other place "semsi" is ever mentioned is here, on 12/7/2007, by Manuel Op de Coul: https://yahootuninggroupsultimatebackup.github.io/tuning-math/topicId_16872.html#16872

			--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

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	:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.		:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.
	:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)		:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

			::: Alright. By that definition ''sensi'' is probably just a contraction. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 02:08, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

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	: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)		: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

			:: A play on words is a pun, or a joke that takes advantage of words with similar sounds or spellings. It is usually somehow amusing, and adds new meaning beyond the meanings of the individual words that were combined. "Sensi", and other mere contractions like it (e.g. "can't", "they're", "semver"), do not meet that definition. A proper example of a play on words would be the name of my friends' company "Cinapse", which combines the words "cinema", "synapse" (and perhaps even the word "apps", too) all together into one word, and this name conveys how their company adds brain-like tooling to movie productions.
			:: Thank you for pointing out that Gene added that information himself. Alright, I accept its authenticity as it is. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 01:34, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

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	--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)		--[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 20:54, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

			: I'm afraid I'm not enlightened on the exact difference between play on words and contraction. To me contraction is a specific type of play on words.

			: Let's note that the entry of sensi was [https://en.xen.wiki/index.php?title=Temperament_names&type=revision&diff=27129&oldid=27130 Gene's own edition] and that should be key evidence for its authenticity, altho the reference I added later only provided partial proof for it. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 00:55, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

	I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I removed the bit on the Sensipent page for now. Previously I wrote that I wasn't sure whether "sensi" was a play on words or a contraction. I realized that I definitely know it's not a play on words, because that doesn't make any sense. So it's either a contraction, or something else. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 18:12, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

	I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)		I found the same statement on the [[Sensamagic clan]] page and removed it there for now, for the same reason. --[[User:Cmloegcmluin\|Cmloegcmluin]] ([[User talk:Cmloegcmluin\|talk]]) 22:18, 29 June 2023 (UTC)