Talk:936/935 - Revision history

FloraC: /* Forms of 17-limit Temperaments */ re

2020-12-31T08:24:13Z

Forms of 17-limit Temperaments: re

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	Hey, Flora, what exactly do you mean when you say that we "don't know what form a 17-limit temperament should take"? --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 07:11, 31 December 2020 (UTC)		Hey, Flora, what exactly do you mean when you say that we "don't know what form a 17-limit temperament should take"? --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 07:11, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

			: Note it's not that we don't know what a 17-limit temperament is; it's that we haven't got examples of such pages for temperaments of a 17-limit comma. Quoting:
			<pre>
			If X is a 3- or 5-limit comma,
			"X family" is for rank-2 temperaments that temper it out.
			If X is a 7-limit comma,
			"X family" is for rank-3 temperaments that temper it out, and "X temperaments" is for rank-2 temperaments that temper it out ("X clan" if the comma is a subgroup comma). See: Marvel family, Marvel temperaments.
			If X is an 11-limit comma,
			"X family" is for rank-4 temperaments that temper it out, and "X temperaments" is for rank-3 temperaments that temper it out. If the "X family" page isn't there (as it doesn't have many 13-limit branches), in "X temperaments" there is a brief of the rank-4 temperaments. See: Keenanismic family, Valinorsmic temperaments, Kalismic temperaments.
			If X is an 13-limit comma,
			there are only three such pages: The Archipelago, The Biosphere, Marveltwin, which list temperaments of various ranks.
			</pre>

			: So we haven't got "X temperaments" for 13-limit commas nor have we determined if there will be, let alone 17-limit. I suggest a discussion in [[Xenharmonic Wiki:Things to do]] if you feel like initiating that project. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 08:24, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura: /* Forms of 17-limit Temperaments */ new section

2020-12-31T07:11:24Z

Forms of 17-limit Temperaments: new section

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	::::: This list is good to have on hand. Perhaps I should make note of the the fact that this comma leads to essentially tempered chords- "ainic chords" in this case, and then make an article showing off some of these chords. Unfortunately, however I don't seem to have a good way of finding all the essentially tempered chords. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 08:38, 29 December 2020 (UTC)		::::: This list is good to have on hand. Perhaps I should make note of the the fact that this comma leads to essentially tempered chords- "ainic chords" in this case, and then make an article showing off some of these chords. Unfortunately, however I don't seem to have a good way of finding all the essentially tempered chords. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 08:38, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

			== Forms of 17-limit Temperaments ==

			Hey, Flora, what exactly do you mean when you say that we "don't know what form a 17-limit temperament should take"? --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 07:11, 31 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura at 08:38, 29 December 2020

2020-12-29T08:38:26Z

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	::: > Perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512.		::: > Perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512.

	::: It's nothing special: any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones.		::: It's nothing special: any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones.

	::: The comma is an essential tempering comma so there should be some essentially tempered chords. We might focus on that. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)		::: The comma is an essential tempering comma so there should be some essentially tempered chords. We might focus on that. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

			:::: It maybe true that any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones or two undertones, but the fact that one of the two overtones in this case was 117/64 is what I found interesting in light of the potential for cultural references. At any rate, it's good to know that this comma leads to essentially tempered chords. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 08:38, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

	:::: These are the triads:		:::: These are the triads:
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	:::: There should be numerous tetrads, pentads, etc. which I don't bother to find. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 07:00, 29 December 2020 (UTC)		:::: There should be numerous tetrads, pentads, etc. which I don't bother to find. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 07:00, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

			::::: This list is good to have on hand. Perhaps I should make note of the the fact that this comma leads to essentially tempered chords- "ainic chords" in this case, and then make an article showing off some of these chords. Unfortunately, however I don't seem to have a good way of finding all the essentially tempered chords. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 08:38, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

FloraC: /* Naming */ chord findings

2020-12-29T07:00:33Z

Naming: chord findings

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	::: The comma is an essential tempering comma so there should be some essentially tempered chords. We might focus on that. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)		::: The comma is an essential tempering comma so there should be some essentially tempered chords. We might focus on that. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

			:::: These are the triads:
			::::* 1-17/16-13/11 with steps 17/16-10/9-22/13, and its inversions;
			::::* 1-10/9-13/11 with steps 10/9-17/16-22/13, and its inversions;
			::::* 1-13/11-24/17 with steps 13/11-6/5-24/17, and its inversions;
			::::* 1-6/5-24/17 with steps 6/5-13/11-24/17, and its inversions;
			::::* 1-18/17-5/4 with steps 18/17-13/11-8/5, and its inversions;
			::::* 1-13/11-5/4 with steps 13/11-18/17-8/5, and its inversions.

			:::: There should be numerous tetrads, pentads, etc. which I don't bother to find. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 07:00, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

FloraC at 06:31, 29 December 2020

2020-12-29T06:31:37Z

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	::: > Perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512.		::: > Perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512.

	::: It's nothing special: any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:03, 29 December 2020 (UTC)		::: It's nothing special: any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones.

			::: The comma is an essential tempering comma so there should be some essentially tempered chords. We might focus on that. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:31, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

FloraC at 06:03, 29 December 2020

2020-12-29T06:03:30Z

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	:: I hope you don't mind my endeavors in this field. I mean, if all we ever do is what everyone else is doing, opportunities will be missed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:42, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: I hope you don't mind my endeavors in this field. I mean, if all we ever do is what everyone else is doing, opportunities will be missed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:42, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

			::: > Perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512.

			::: It's nothing special: any interval can be decomposed into a difference of two overtones. [[User:FloraC\|FloraC]] ([[User talk:FloraC\|talk]]) 06:03, 29 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura at 22:42, 28 December 2020

2020-12-28T22:42:31Z

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	:: As for the idea of generating content from nothing, well, that sounds almost like a part of my job description as a pioneer in microtonal music theory- to explore intervals and temperaments where few have explored before, and to find the beauty in intervals that other music theorists have overlooked, ignored, or dismissed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:39, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: As for the idea of generating content from nothing, well, that sounds almost like a part of my job description as a pioneer in microtonal music theory- to explore intervals and temperaments where few have explored before, and to find the beauty in intervals that other music theorists have overlooked, ignored, or dismissed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:39, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

	:: I hope you don't mind my endeavors in this field. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:40, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: I hope you don't mind my endeavors in this field. I mean, if all we ever do is what everyone else is doing, opportunities will be missed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:42, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura at 22:40, 28 December 2020

2020-12-28T22:40:27Z

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	:: As for the idea of generating content from nothing, well, that sounds almost like a part of my job description as a pioneer in microtonal music theory- to explore intervals and temperaments where few have explored before, and to find the beauty in intervals that other music theorists have overlooked, ignored, or dismissed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:39, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: As for the idea of generating content from nothing, well, that sounds almost like a part of my job description as a pioneer in microtonal music theory- to explore intervals and temperaments where few have explored before, and to find the beauty in intervals that other music theorists have overlooked, ignored, or dismissed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:39, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

			:: I hope you don't mind my endeavors in this field. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:40, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura at 22:39, 28 December 2020

2020-12-28T22:39:46Z

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	:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

			:: As for the idea of generating content from nothing, well, that sounds almost like a part of my job description as a pioneer in microtonal music theory- to explore intervals and temperaments where few have explored before, and to find the beauty in intervals that other music theorists have overlooked, ignored, or dismissed. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 22:39, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

Aura at 22:26, 28 December 2020

2020-12-28T22:26:25Z

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	: In my opinion the importance of a comma/temperament/whatever should be obvious before we bind much energy in dedicated pages/names/etc. I sometimes have the impression that we are - in part - generating content from nothing here. --[[User:Xenwolf\|Xenwolf]] ([[User talk:Xenwolf\|talk]]) 19:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		: In my opinion the importance of a comma/temperament/whatever should be obvious before we bind much energy in dedicated pages/names/etc. I sometimes have the impression that we are - in part - generating content from nothing here. --[[User:Xenwolf\|Xenwolf]] ([[User talk:Xenwolf\|talk]]) 19:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

	:: I'm already looking into what's going on with this comma, and so far I've found that tempering out this comma equates 18/17 with 55/52, 17/13 ~~1ith~~ 72/55, 24/17 with 55/39, 144/143 with 170/169, 44/39 with 96/85, and perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512. The reason I find that lattermost instances of equated intervals interesting has more to do with cultural reference- particularly with regards to the Halo series of videogames as the Master Chief- the protagonist of the main series Halo games, is also known as "John-117". I'm still looking into this comma to see if I can find anything else of interest. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 20:17, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: I'm already looking into what's going on with this comma, and so far I've found that tempering out this comma equates 18/17 with 55/52, 17/13 with 72/55, 24/17 with 55/39, 144/143 with 170/169, 44/39 with 96/85, and perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512. The reason I find that lattermost instances of equated intervals interesting has more to do with cultural reference- particularly with regards to the Halo series of videogames as the Master Chief- the protagonist of the main series Halo games, is also known as "John-117". I'm still looking into this comma to see if I can find anything else of interest. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 20:17, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

	:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:26, 28 December 2020
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	: In my opinion the importance of a comma/temperament/whatever should be obvious before we bind much energy in dedicated pages/names/etc. I sometimes have the impression that we are - in part - generating content from nothing here. --[[User:Xenwolf\|Xenwolf]] ([[User talk:Xenwolf\|talk]]) 19:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		: In my opinion the importance of a comma/temperament/whatever should be obvious before we bind much energy in dedicated pages/names/etc. I sometimes have the impression that we are - in part - generating content from nothing here. --[[User:Xenwolf\|Xenwolf]] ([[User talk:Xenwolf\|talk]]) 19:25, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

	:: I'm already looking into what's going on with this comma, and so far I've found that tempering out this comma equates 18/17 with 55/52, 17/13 ~~1ith~~ 72/55, 24/17 with 55/39, 144/143 with 170/169, 44/39 with 96/85, and perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512. The reason I find that lattermost instances of equated intervals interesting has more to do with cultural reference- particularly with regards to the Halo series of videogames as the Master Chief- the protagonist of the main series Halo games, is also known as "John-117". I'm still looking into this comma to see if I can find anything else of interest. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 20:17, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: I'm already looking into what's going on with this comma, and so far I've found that tempering out this comma equates 18/17 with 55/52, 17/13 with 72/55, 24/17 with 55/39, 144/143 with 170/169, 44/39 with 96/85, and perhaps most interestingly for me- 117/64 with 935/512. The reason I find that lattermost instances of equated intervals interesting has more to do with cultural reference- particularly with regards to the Halo series of videogames as the Master Chief- the protagonist of the main series Halo games, is also known as "John-117". I'm still looking into this comma to see if I can find anything else of interest. --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 20:17, 28 December 2020 (UTC)

	:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)		:: After further investigation, it seems that by tempering out 936/935, we end up equating [[289/288]] with [[221/220]], [[256/255]] with [[352/351]], [[375/374]] with [[625/624]], [[351/350]] with [[561/560]], and- in another interesting twist- [[385/384]] (the keenanisma) with [[273/272]] (the tannisma). --[[User:Aura\|Aura]] ([[User talk:Aura\|talk]]) 21:44, 28 December 2020 (UTC)