17edo neutral scale - Revision history

BudjarnLambeth: /* 17edo neutral scale */ link to neutral thirds scale

2024-03-12T23:06:39Z

17edo neutral scale: link to neutral thirds scale

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:06, 12 March 2024
Line 3:		Line 3:
	A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!		A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!

	We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[neutrominant]] temperament. In [[17edo]] that means the interval of five degrees of 17.		We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. It is an example of a [[neutral thirds scale]]. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[neutrominant]] temperament. In [[17edo]] that means the interval of five degrees of 17.

	Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:		Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:

BudjarnLambeth: /* modes of 7-note neutral scale */ Replaced 7 idiosyncratic inlines with 1 idiosyncratic terms mbox

2024-03-02T03:06:13Z

modes of 7-note neutral scale: Replaced 7 idiosyncratic inlines with 1 idiosyncratic terms mbox

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:06, 2 March 2024
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	=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===		=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===

			{{Idiosyncratic terms\|The 7 proposed mode names}}

	Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I ([[Andrew Heathwaite]]) have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:		Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I ([[Andrew Heathwaite]]) have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 1 : bish~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 1 : bish
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
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	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 2 : dril~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 2 : dril
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 178:		Line 180:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 3 : fish~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 3 : fish
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 200:		Line 202:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 4 : gil~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 4 : gil
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 222:		Line 224:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 5 : jwl~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 5 : jwl
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 244:		Line 246:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 6 : kleeth~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 6 : kleeth
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 266:		Line 268:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 7 : led~~{{idiosyncratic}}~~		! mode 7 : led
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between

BudjarnLambeth: Added idiosyncratic templates, changed maqamic to neutrominant

2024-01-27T04:56:02Z

Added idiosyncratic templates, changed maqamic to neutrominant

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:56, 27 January 2024
Line 3:		Line 3:
	A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!		A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!

	We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[~~maqamic\|maqamic temperament~~]]. In [[17edo]] that means the interval of five degrees of 17.		We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[neutrominant]] temperament. In [[17edo]] that means the interval of five degrees of 17.

	Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:		Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:
Line 40:		Line 40:

	We have arrived again at a MOS scale, of type 3L+4s ("mosh" according to the [[MOSNamingScheme]]).		We have arrived again at a MOS scale, of type 3L+4s ("mosh" according to the [[MOSNamingScheme]]).

	==Interval chain==		==Interval chain==
	Viewing 17edo as a temperament on the 2.3.7.11.13 subgroup, we get the following interpretation for the 2122122212 mode of the 10-note MOS scale:		Viewing 17edo as a temperament on the 2.3.7.11.13 subgroup, we get the following interpretation for the 2122122212 mode of the 10-note MOS scale:
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	<references/>		<references/>

	The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). Some may prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.		The 6th degree can be raised by a [[chroma]] to a 23/16 (-5 generators). Some may prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.

	== 7-note neutral scale ==		== 7-note neutral scale ==
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	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 1 : bish		! mode 1 : bish{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 155:		Line 156:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 2 : dril		! mode 2 : dril{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 177:		Line 178:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 3 : fish		! mode 3 : fish{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 199:		Line 200:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 4 : gil		! mode 4 : gil{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 221:		Line 222:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 5 : jwl		! mode 5 : jwl{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 243:		Line 244:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 6 : kleeth		! mode 6 : kleeth{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between
Line 265:		Line 266:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
	! mode 7 : led		! mode 7 : led{{idiosyncratic}}
	! from bottom		! from bottom
	! in between		! in between

Keenan Pepper category edits: Moving from Category:Mos to Category:MOS scales using Cat-a-lot

2020-12-04T23:06:27Z

Moving from Category:Mos to Category:MOS scales using Cat-a-lot

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:06, 4 December 2020
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	[[Category:17edo]]		[[Category:17edo]]
	[[Category:Modes]]		[[Category:Modes]]
	[[Category:~~Mos~~]]		[[Category:MOS scales]]
	[[Category:Neutral]]		[[Category:Neutral]]
	[[Category:Neutral second]]		[[Category:Neutral second]]
	[[Category:Neutral third]]		[[Category:Neutral third]]

Xenwolf: sorry Inthar, I got the author wrong, hopefully this can be rephrased to something more readable

2020-09-07T12:51:49Z

sorry Inthar, I got the author wrong, hopefully this can be rephrased to something more readable

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:51, 7 September 2020
Line 130:		Line 130:
	=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===		=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===

	Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I ([[~~User:IlL\|Inthar~~]]) have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:		Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I ([[Andrew Heathwaite]]) have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
Line 298:		Line 298:
	== Some brief note on the 3, 7 and 10 note MOS ==		== Some brief note on the 3, 7 and 10 note MOS ==

	You can also take call the neutral sixth the generator, which I ([[~~User:IlL\|Inthar~~]]) personally favour as it is an (approximate) harmonic rather than a subharmonic. But that's because it's how I use it, you might not. If you see it this way, the 3rd harmonic is harmonically opposite to the 13th harmonic, because, (13/8)^2 ~ 4/3, the perfect fourth being an upside down perfect fifth.		You can also take call the neutral sixth the generator, which I ([[Andrew Heathwaite]]) personally favour as it is an (approximate) harmonic rather than a subharmonic. But that's because it's how I use it, you might not. If you see it this way, the 3rd harmonic is harmonically opposite to the 13th harmonic, because, (13/8)^2 ~ 4/3, the perfect fourth being an upside down perfect fifth.

	You might also find that the 10-note scale can be formed by two 17-tone pythagoresque pentatonic scales a neutral interval apart, implying something of a different approach. And one of the loveliest things I find about them is the ease with which one can play 8:11:13 chords, so there are some frightening blues licks in this decatonic scale. R'lyeh blues anyone?		You might also find that the 10-note scale can be formed by two 17-tone pythagoresque pentatonic scales a neutral interval apart, implying something of a different approach. And one of the loveliest things I find about them is the ease with which one can play 8:11:13 chords, so there are some frightening blues licks in this decatonic scale. R'lyeh blues anyone?

Xenwolf: link to 17edo added, in some places clarified the meaning of the initial author (which was I so far)

2020-09-07T12:46:42Z

link to 17edo added, in some places clarified the meaning of the initial author (which was I so far)

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:46, 7 September 2020
Line 3:		Line 3:
	A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!		A lovely system of Middle-Eastern flavored scales!

	We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[maqamic\|maqamic temperament]]. In 17edo that means the interval of five degrees of 17.		We can call the [[MOSScales\|Moment of Symmetry]] scale derived from a 5/17 generator & an octave repeat the '''17edo Neutral Scale'''. We build it by stacking neutral thirds, the generator of the [[maqamic\|maqamic temperament]]. In [[17edo]] that means the interval of five degrees of 17.

	Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:		Begin anywhere. Let's call our first pitch (& its octave transposition) 0:
Line 130:		Line 130:
	=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===		=== modes of 7-note neutral scale ===

	Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:		Naturally, with seven notes we have seven modes, depending on which note we make the starting pitch (tonic) of the scale. I ([[User:IlL\|Inthar]]) have given these modes a one-syllable name for my own use. Feel free to name (or not name) these modes as you see fit:

	{\| class="wikitable"		{\| class="wikitable"
Line 298:		Line 298:
	== Some brief note on the 3, 7 and 10 note MOS ==		== Some brief note on the 3, 7 and 10 note MOS ==

	You can also take call the neutral sixth the generator, which I personally favour as it is an (approximate) harmonic rather than a subharmonic. But that's because it's how I use it, you might not. If you see it this way, the 3rd harmonic is harmonically opposite to the 13th harmonic, because, (13/8)^2 ~ 4/3, the perfect fourth being an upside down perfect fifth.		You can also take call the neutral sixth the generator, which I ([[User:IlL\|Inthar]]) personally favour as it is an (approximate) harmonic rather than a subharmonic. But that's because it's how I use it, you might not. If you see it this way, the 3rd harmonic is harmonically opposite to the 13th harmonic, because, (13/8)^2 ~ 4/3, the perfect fourth being an upside down perfect fifth.

	You might also find that the 10-note scale can be formed by two 17-tone pythagoresque pentatonic scales a neutral interval apart, implying something of a different approach. And one of the loveliest things I find about them is the ease with which one can play 8:11:13 chords, so there are some frightening blues licks in this decatonic scale. R'lyeh blues anyone?		You might also find that the 10-note scale can be formed by two 17-tone pythagoresque pentatonic scales a neutral interval apart, implying something of a different approach. And one of the loveliest things I find about them is the ease with which one can play 8:11:13 chords, so there are some frightening blues licks in this decatonic scale. R'lyeh blues anyone?

Inthar: /* Interval chain */ language should be less subjective, since this page is written by multiple people

2020-07-10T17:31:31Z

Interval chain: language should be less subjective, since this page is written by multiple people

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:31, 10 July 2020
Line 112:		Line 112:
	<references/>		<references/>

	The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). I prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.		The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). Some may prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.

	== 7-note neutral scale ==		== 7-note neutral scale ==

Xenwolf: /* Interval chain */ finally got it.

2020-07-10T15:36:59Z

Interval chain: finally got it.

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:36, 10 July 2020
Line 44:		Line 44:
	{\| class="wikitable sortable right-1 right-2"		{\| class="wikitable sortable right-1 right-2"
	\|-		\|-
	! ~~Degree~~		! Step# of scale<ref>In terms of the 10-note MOS scale, 1-based (unison=1)</ref>
	! Steps of 17edo		! Steps of 17edo<ref>Amount of steps of 17edo, 0-based (often called "degree")</ref>
	! Note name on C		! Note name on C
	! Harmonics approximated		! Harmonics approximated
Line 110:		Line 110:
	\| +5		\| +5
	\|}		\|}
			<references/>

	The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). I prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.		The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). I prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.

Inthar: /* Interval chain */

2020-07-10T11:52:01Z

Interval chain

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:52, 10 July 2020
Line 45:		Line 45:
	\|-		\|-
	! Degree		! Degree
	! ~~Degree~~ of 17edo		! Steps of 17edo
	! Note name on C		! Note name on C
	! Harmonics approximated		! Harmonics approximated

Inthar: /* Interval chain */ corrections, use harmonically simpler interpretation of 11/8

2020-07-10T10:42:25Z

Interval chain: corrections, use harmonically simpler interpretation of 11/8

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:42, 10 July 2020
Line 41:		Line 41:
	We have arrived again at a MOS scale, of type 3L+4s ("mosh" according to the [[MOSNamingScheme]]).		We have arrived again at a MOS scale, of type 3L+4s ("mosh" according to the [[MOSNamingScheme]]).
	==Interval chain==		==Interval chain==
			Viewing 17edo as a temperament on the 2.3.7.11.13 subgroup, we get the following interpretation for the 2122122212 mode of the 10-note MOS scale:
	Viewing 17edo as a temperament on the 2.3.5.7.11.13~~.23.25~~ subgroup, we get the following interpretation for the 10-note MOS scale:


	{\| class="wikitable sortable right-1 right-2"		{\| class="wikitable sortable right-1 right-2"
	\|-		\|-
Line 52:		Line 49:
	! Harmonics approximated		! Harmonics approximated
	! #Gens up		! #Gens up
	\|-
	~~\| 6~~
	~~\| style="text-align:right;" \| 9~~
	~~\| Gd~~
	~~\| '''23/16'''~~
	~~\| -5~~
	\|-		\|-
	\| 9		\| 9
Line 112:		Line 103:
	\| '''9/8'''		\| '''9/8'''
	\| +4		\| +4
			\|-
			\| 6
			\| 8
			\| F+
			\| '''11/8'''
			\| +5
	\|}		\|}
	The 6th degree can be ~~swapped for~~ a 11/8 (+5 generators) ~~by lowering it by a chroma~~. I prefer using the sharper ~~note~~ because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.		The 6th degree can be raised by a chroma to a 23/16 (-5 generators). I prefer using the sharper 6th degree because it makes a 7/4 with the 8th degree.

	== 7-note neutral scale ==		== 7-note neutral scale ==